Comments on: Thoughts on President Monson

By: Just for Quix

Just for Quix — Thu, 03 Apr 2008 16:32:05 +0000

Dale (33): Many essays here are not “hyper-critical”, whether of church or of “non-members”. Now the ensuing discussions, well sometimes that’s true, but I think most strive for useful dialogue. Let’s not let the “No True Scotsman” fallacy color the argument for those LDS here who reasonably, productively, and thoughtfully explore and grapple with their relationship to LDS culture, doctrine, hierarchy, and practice– each separate categories for discussion. As for me, well I’m a former Mormon Christian-convert, so please feel free to criticize me for “apostatizing” and getting on with my life in God’s Grace.

By: Dale Porter

Dale Porter — Thu, 03 Apr 2008 14:56:27 +0000

I have been visiting this blog site for the past couple of days. While I generally enjoy LDS blog sites and individual incites on the LDS faith and culture, I’m surprised at the hyper-critical nature of the essays I’ve read. As I once explained to my agnostic father: I’m not aware of any church that requires members to be perfect in order to join, or any church that claims it will instantaneously perfect its members.
We are only allotted so much time upon this earth, we should never waste it. For the majority of those who have spent time whining in this format, please apostatize now, don’t stretch out the process. Get on with life you’ve been given.

By: JJackson

JJackson — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 03:55:01 +0000

I’ve had a hard time (for several years now) reconciling my support of the church with my personal distaste for Pres. Monson. He’s just not my cup of tea. I really miss Neal A. Maxwell, though I know others could hardly endure what they thought of as alliterative tedium (though the ones who didn’t like him probably wouldn’t have had the vocabulary to call it that). Eyring, Bedanr, Oaks – give me more! Holland and Scott, not so much, but THAT’S JUST ME.

And that’s the point. With several million of us to please twice a year, it’s great that there are so many different approaches and styles. Pres. Hinckley may have been a bit unique with his almost universal appeal. The test for me now is to see how I react when a “non-favorite” is at the helm.

Just about the only thing I actually worry about is the further entrenchment and canonization of the cult that scouting has become within our culture. But that isn’t THAT much of a big deal. I’ll be a little less jazzed to listen to the last talk of Priesthood Session, but I can deal with that.

By: Ray

Ray — Tue, 25 Mar 2008 20:07:46 +0000

We don’t believe what we see; we see what we believe.

By: Just for Quix

Just for Quix — Tue, 25 Mar 2008 19:50:56 +0000

What’s up with Eyering’s smirk he frequently has at press conferences? It’s like he’s in on the joke, and his body language can’t help but give it away…

By: Mike Conder

Mike Conder — Tue, 25 Mar 2008 16:09:41 +0000

My wife swam with him once in a public pool and spoke to him briefly. She said he was pleasant.

By: Carl Youngblood

Carl Youngblood — Tue, 25 Mar 2008 03:42:57 +0000

18: Dan, isn’t it also possible that allowing all these children to die is not God’s will? Isn’t it possible that He expects us to do something about it? Without the voluntary obedience of His subjects, His purposes aren’t accomplished. In other words, heaven won’t exist unless we build it ourselves, with his help, of course. Here are Brigham Young’s sentiments:

“You may now be inclined to say, ‘O, this is too simple and child-like, we wish to hear the mysteries of the kingdoms of the Gods who have existed from eternity and of all the kingdoms in which they will dwell; we desire to have these things portrayed to our understandings.’ Allow me to inform you that you are in the midst of it all now, that you are in just as good a kingdom as you will ever attain to, from now to all eternity, unless you make it yourselves by the grace of God, by the will of God, by the eternal Priesthood of God, which is a code of laws perfectly calculated to govern and control eternal matter. If you and I do not by this means make that better kingdom which we anticipate, we shall never enjoy it. We can only enjoy the kingdom we have labored to make.” (JD 3:336)

By: Carlos

Carlos — Tue, 25 Mar 2008 03:41:45 +0000

Trying again:

Terrific post. Thank you for the honesty and insight into Pt Monson whom I’ve never meat nor seen up close.

Great story about going to mow his grass in a business shirt; tops. Also liked what Dan Knudsen wrote.

Nick #4,

I also got fed up once with Pt Monson style until I started looking for the hidden message, the moral of the story, and then I started to appreciate them more and see more ‘revelations’ and ‘prophesy’ in them. Even this snake story (eg when nothing wrong is done still some things belong in their own homes and not in ours) have several different messages which each person interprets in a way that the spirit nudges us to.

By: hawkgrrrl

hawkgrrrl — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 23:36:35 +0000

“Dude, he’s the king of ham.” And L.Tom Perry is generally acknowledged to be the cheesy one. I think we may have the makings of a casserole. Which one is like Campbell’s cream of mushroom soup? Which one is like crushed potato chips?

By: wren

wren — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 21:57:42 +0000

This is the press conf that Eyring spoke at that I appreciated tremendously.

By: RLDDS

RLDDS — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 21:52:23 +0000

As far as the rumor about memorizing a scripture a day as a missionary I have heard President Monson himself admit that he never has taught such a thing. At a missionary meeting in Toronto Canada where I was serving he brought the subject up and said that while he is sure that memorizing a scripture a day would certainly improve one’s memory he had never promised nor did he believe it would result in a photographic memory.

I was devestated.

By: wren

wren — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 21:25:18 +0000

I’ve heard and read about all that Monson did when he was placed as Bishop of a ward with numerous widows. He was very young and reportedly got a lot accomplished. He may be a lot done as president. Can’t imagine his as dynamic or personable as Hinckley but that risk would apply to anyone following GBH.

If Henry B Eyring ever made it to that office I’d be half tempted to rejoin. I have more respect for him and consequently his testimony than any other GA I’ve heard. Hearing his testimony makes me want to believe. Though that’s not enough, I do respect him for it.

By: AdamF

AdamF — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 20:46:19 +0000

I have heard a lot of the stories more than once, but he's given some memorable talks as well. This one is one of my favorites: They Pray and They Go.

By: Just for Quix

Just for Quix — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 20:26:22 +0000

I think Monson’s pulpit personality is a bit phony, in that I’ve seen his business persona, and have friends in publishing that have experienced his business side: he’s pretty gruff around the edges, and can be quite cool and aloof. That said, I do believe people can change if they want to. One hopes the mantle of leadership for an influential organization like the LDS church could change him so his favorite pulpit topics of service become more than quaint and charming stories, and transition to the church being known even more for genuine, authentic and wider inter-faith and humanitarian services. (So far, as a proportion of income, the LDS church’s humanitarian arm could still be more robust.)

Even knowing Monson can have (or at least has had) a nitpicking and demanding side I liked his story of his inaugural press conference about his favorite color yellow. As a publishing professional, I liked how he addressed the importance of yellow in how it is so vital to the liveliness of flesh tones and beauty in pictures. That said, yellow couldn’t sustain the life of press-printed images without the other 3 (or more) colors. Here’s to hoping that he works intentionally to bring more balance and improvement to the style of interface the church has with critics, media and its international believers.

By: Dan Knudsen

Dan Knudsen — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 19:31:16 +0000

It’s a good thing–in more ways than one–that a lot of us were never in the Tab Choir, all those years when Elder Hinckley came to their Christmas parties and had everyone rolling on the floor with laughter, because we’d have been complaining, “That’s the next prophet?” The neat thing about it is that it’s possible to find something amiss with each prophet throughout history, because none of them were perfect–so what? The fact is that the prophets have all worked hard in fulfilling their callings, probably more so than the rest of us, who are at least alert enough to complain about the weaknesses that we see (or maybe even imagine) in them. There is more to the world, and the Church, than what we see with our limited vision and understanding. And, you know, I see things all the things that need to be corrected, and it makes me so mad that the Lord doesn’t come and consult me before telling His prophet what to do–I’ve got all these great ideas that would make it all so much easier for everyone!

#15–Equality: You forgot to add something else about God murdering innocent people–the billions of innocent young children who’ve died. God is in charge of everything, so He did that, too; if He were all-loving, and believed in Equality, they’d have been allowed to live a normal life span like we get to live. And, that’s not just the Mormon God doing that, as He was doing that long before Mormons were around. Have you ever been eliminated from something for which you were in line? How cruel that someone did that to you, or anyone else–but wasn’t it actually God who did it, since He didn’t prevent it?

By: John Nilsson

John Nilsson — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 18:56:13 +0000

I find President Monson endearing. He did the same trick at a regional conference I attended, reading letters to the First Presidency from kids who wanted to know if it were OK to kill starlings if they became a nuisance and other such things. He then read his replies which were hilarious, especially considering how serious these letter-writers were probably expecting the answers to be.

The experience was fun and a chance to see someone held in unnaturally high esteem as approachable and human. He that has ears to hear let him hear…

By: no-man

no-man — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 18:16:03 +0000

>> In fact, sometimes his style is a bit hammy.

A bit? Dude, he’s the king of ham. He is the guru of ham. <<

In 2006, Pres Monson spoke at a Utah County-wide area conference, two sessions in the BYU Marriott Center. In both sessions, he spent 15-20 minutes reading from some of the goofy letters that members (and children) send to the First Presidency. He’d read one, then pull a face and wait for the audience to laugh. It was like a comedian trying out new material, and his mugging was tedious and went on way too long. In the morning session, he never did seem to get to a sermon, just chatted aimlessly. In the afternoon session, he demonstrated his ability to wiggle his ears.

The experience was confusing. This is the next prophet of the Church?

By: Equality

Equality — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 16:42:37 +0000

“and through eliminating the others who were ahead of him in line of authority”

Wow, and some people think it’s only the Old Testament God who is a ruthless murderer of innocents. Looks like the modern Mormon God is still following that pattern, eh?

By: Dan Knudsen

Dan Knudsen — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 16:21:59 +0000

#13–My comments were made in the spirit of support of the office, not in the spirit of infallibility of the prophet. President Monson is a hard worker and will do his best to fulfill his calling, whether we like him or not, and our support helps. Joseph Smith seemed to always know what was going to happen, until the end when he was called a coward for crossing the river to go out west; after that he didn’t seem to know as much of what was going to happen because of the lack of support of the church (this idea was mentioned in a class from Hyrum Andrus back in the late 60s). The Lord determines who is to be His prophet through the training and experiences he receives in preparation, and through eliminating the others who were ahead of him in line of authority–whether we like who He has chosen or not.

By: Carlos

Carlos — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 15:24:37 +0000

Can’t see my comment after refreshing. Where’s it going to?

Or are they moderated now?

By: Carlos

Carlos — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 15:22:06 +0000

My comment keeps disappearing! (just in case I post twice)

Terrific post. Thank you for the honesty and insight into Pt Monson whom I’ve never meat nor seen up close.

Great story about going to mow his grass in a business shirt; tops. Also liked what Dan Knudsen wrote.

Nick #4,

By: Nick Literski

Nick Literski — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 14:54:06 +0000

I have no idea what he’ll do, or what he’ll change, but it’ll be what’s needed as long as he’s there. Aye, there's the rub. Despite officially denying any doctrine of presidential infalliability, modern faithful LDS certainly tend to operate from such a viewpoint. A president of the LDS church simply can't do anything "wrong," because what he does is right by definition. His behavior defines what is good and right in faithful LDS culture, because of the degree of confidence (dare I say, in some cases, idolatrous worship?) they place in the person and office. To think otherwise causes cognitive dissonance. Ergo, whatever Monson does will be "just what the LDS church needed at this time."

By: Dan

Dan — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 13:43:23 +0000

In fact, sometimes his style is a bit hammy.

A bit? Dude, he’s the king of ham. He is the guru of ham.

I’ve never met President Monson but I have met President Eyring. He spoke at our stake conference in 1994 before he became a General Authority. He brought the Spirit with him and it was on that day that I made my decision to go on my mission. In fact I felt so strong a confirmation from the Spirit that day that I needed to get going now! I thanked him briefly on his way out. And that was that.

By: Benjamin O

Benjamin O — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 12:41:13 +0000

Monson is pretty well known for his memory. If I recall correctly, he is an eiditic, or close to and there are rumors that he has stated that if a person will memorize a verse of scripture a day they can soon develop similar memory skills. I don’t have a source for this, but the rumors don’t seem to want to die either, so take that for what you will.

What will Monson do as Prophet? Who knows? I rather suspect that he is still figuring this out. You will all note that, at least for those of us outside SLC area, things have been VERY quiet in terms of church news since Monson took on the Presidency. I have a feeling that he has been very busy getting plans together and trying to understand exactly what his role is to be in the coming years. I wonder if he has laid things out in full just yet…

By: Dan Knudsen

Dan Knudsen — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 03:54:04 +0000

It’s been interesting to read all the comments on President Monson. I have had several occasions to talk to him, and came away with mixed reactions.

August 15, 1964, he came to the Northern California Mission and spent the day with us at the Multi-Stake Center next to the Oakland Temple (which was being built then). He interviewed each missionary, and when my turn came, he asked how long I had left and I replied that I had a month; he said, “Then make it the best month of your mission!” The highlight of the day came during the question and answer period in the afternoon, when Elder McCann (from South Australia) asked him if an apostle had to have a personal witness of Christ to be an apostle; he answered that he didn’t have to, to be one, but that they were to live so that they could; then he smiled his big, wide smile, and he seemed to glow as he said, “Brethren, it’s true! We don’t talk about it because it’s sacred to us.” Then he added, “The Church is true,” which carried more power of the Spirit than that phrase normally does.

I sang in the Tab Choir from 1976-1996, and got to hear him talk many times; only once did he use the teleprompter, as the rest of his talks were memorized, which is quite a feat. His talk delivery style isn’t my favorite style, as I like longer phrases; but, so what? That’s his style.

President Monson had been friends with my mission president, and when he died, he came to speak at his funeral. When he came into the chapel and saw me on the stand, he came straight to me and said, “I see we’re going to have some good singing today!” which surprised me, as I didn’t know he’d remember me from the choir.

He’s been through the line of elimination for this position and is the man for the job and will do what is needed. I have no idea what he’ll do, or what he’ll change, but it’ll be what’s needed as long as he’s there. There is no need to worry about how we’ll get by without President Hinckley.