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		<title>Mormon Matters</title>
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	<itunes:subtitle>A weekly podcast exploring Mormon current events, pop culture, politics and spirituality</itunes:subtitle>
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		<item>
		<title>Hanging Out with Apostles at Sunstone</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/08/06/hanging-out-with-apostles-at-sunstone/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/08/06/hanging-out-with-apostles-at-sunstone/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Aug 2010 05:25:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Mormon Heretic</dc:creator>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=12407</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Sunstone has been going on since Wednesday here in Salt Lake City.  It ends tomorrow, and I thought I would give a few words about the conference.  I have been blogging here at Mormon matters for about a year and a half, and have never met any other bloggers here&#8230;.until this week!  It has been nice to nice BiV and Stephen Marsh.  I hope to meet others tomorrow.  It was also nice to meet with a few apostles. I met Paul at the MHA convention in May, and he gave a presentation titled &#8220;Why Elijah (or John the Baptist) must come before Christ&#8217;s Return&#8221;.  I wasn&#8217;t able to attend his presentation, but spoke with him for a few minutes.  I learned he is one of 6 apostles for his church, based in Independence, Missouri.  Their church believes apostles are the highest office in the church, and they believe that many people can be prophets.  He noted that the Ephesians 4:11 lists apostles before prophets, so apostles should be the top of the hierarchy. And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; It was fun talking to him.  I&#8217;ve been reading Scattering of [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div id="attachment_12408" class="wp-caption alignright" style="width: 160px"><a href="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/Apostle-Paul-Savage.jpg"><img class="size-thumbnail wp-image-12408" title="Apostle-Paul-Savage" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/Apostle-Paul-Savage-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a><p class="wp-caption-text">Apostle Paul Savage of the Church of Christ with the Elijah Message</p></div>
<p>Sunstone has been going on since Wednesday here in Salt Lake City.  It ends tomorrow, and I thought I would give a few words about the conference.  I have been blogging here at Mormon matters for about a year and a half, and have never met any other bloggers here&#8230;.until this week!  It has been nice to nice BiV and Stephen Marsh.  I hope to meet others tomorrow.  It was also nice to meet with a few apostles.</p>
<p><span id="more-12407"></span>I met Paul at the MHA convention in May, and he gave a presentation titled &#8220;Why Elijah (or John the Baptist) must come before Christ&#8217;s Return&#8221;.  I wasn&#8217;t able to attend his presentation, but spoke with him for a few minutes.  I learned he is one of 6 apostles for his church, based in Independence, Missouri.  Their church believes apostles are the highest office in the church, and they believe that many people can be prophets.  He noted that the Ephesians 4:11 lists apostles before prophets, so apostles should be the top of the hierarchy.</p>
<blockquote><p>And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;</p></blockquote>
<div id="attachment_12409" class="wp-caption alignleft" style="width: 160px"><a href="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/CoC-Pres-Robin-Linkart.jpg"><img class="size-thumbnail wp-image-12409" title="CoC-Pres-Robin-Linkart" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/CoC-Pres-Robin-Linkart-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a><p class="wp-caption-text">Robin Linkart, President of the 6th Quorum of Seventy for the Community of Christ</p></div>
<p>It was fun talking to him.  I&#8217;ve been reading <a href="http://www.johnwhitmerbooks.com/books/details_SOS.asp">Scattering of the Saints</a> by John Hamer and Newell Bringhurst, and plan to talk more about Paul&#8217;s church in the future.  I also enjoyed meeting with Apostle Susan Skoor of the Community of Christ, formerly known as the RLDS church.  (I already have a photo of her on my previous post&#8211;<a href="http://mormonmatters.org/2010/06/01/a-schismatic-end-to-the-mormon-history-association-meetings/">click here</a>.)  She is always extremely friendly, and a treat to meet.  She introduced me to Robin Linkart, the President of the 6th Quorum of Seventy.  She lives in Colorado, and is in charge of missionary efforts in the western United States from the Canadian border to Mexico, California to Kansas.  (Sorry the photos are out of focus&#8211;I guess my $40 camera is only worth what I paid for it.)</p>
<div id="attachment_12410" class="wp-caption alignright" style="width: 160px"><a href="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/CoC-Historian-Mark-Sherer.jpg"><img class="size-thumbnail wp-image-12410" title="CoC-Historian-Mark-Scherer" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/CoC-Historian-Mark-Sherer-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a><p class="wp-caption-text">CoC Historian Mark Scherer</p></div>
<p>Mark Scherer, is the historian for the Community of Christ.  He gave an interesting presentation on the latest revelation to be canonized in the Community of Christ, section 164 of the Doctrine and Covenants.  He said the revelation covers 4 main topics:  (1) open communion, (2) open baptism (don&#8217;t have to be rebaptized to join the RLDS church anymore), (3) moral and ethical behavior (allows countries to decide if they want to allow same sex marriage), and (4) the RLDS strives to collaborate more with evangelical Christians.</p>
<p>Bridget Jack Meyers, (aka &#8220;Jack&#8221;&#8211;she blogs at <a href="http://www.clobberblog.com/">Clobberblog</a>), gave a fascinating presentation called &#8220;Evidence for Women&#8217;s Priesthood in the Earliest Christianity.  She is a &#8220;never Mormon&#8221; that earned a BA degree from BYU and &#8220;seduced&#8221; (her words) a Mormon man there.  She is studying at Trinity Evangelical Divinity School.  She outlined various scriptures showing early women Christian leaders, including a woman by the name of Junia in Romans 16:7.  Jack says Junia was a female apostle, and quoted early Christian theologian John Chrysostum discussing her.  Early Christian theologian Origen discussed a female leader by the name of Phoebe.  Jack gave many other examples, and it certainly deserves a blog post or two to discuss her research.</p>
<p>Yesterday, I was able to attend <a href="http://mormonmatters.org/author/stephen-marsh/">Stephen Marsh</a>&#8216;s session called &#8220;How an Unpleasant Truth Can Be More Inspirational than a Pleasant Fiction.&#8221;  I learned that the session was based on his post from October, titled <a href="http://mormonmatters.org/2009/10/22/the-stories-we-tell-2/">The Stories We Tell</a>.  Briefly, Stephen told the true story about his daughter standing up for a disabled classmate.  Often stories such as this end with a happy ending where everyone realizes that they shouldn&#8217;t tease a disabled person, but in Stephen&#8217;s story, his daughter becomes ostracized.  Often, we don&#8217;t have happy endings, and sometimes it is hard to understand why God doesn&#8217;t bless us for doing the right thing.  I also learned that Stephen has 5 daughters, but 3 of them have died, despite his prayers to have them live.  It was an interesting presentation.  Often we learn more from our trials than our triumphs.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m excited to attend tomorrow.  If you&#8217;re in SLC, I encourage you to attend.  It&#8217;s at the Sheraton Hotel on 150 West 500 South.  If you attended, what sessions did you enjoy?  Do you have any questions about the sessions I attended?</p>
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		<slash:comments>10</slash:comments>
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		<item>
		<title>Elder Brown Defines Political Extremism</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/08/03/elder-brown-defines-political-extremism/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/08/03/elder-brown-defines-political-extremism/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Aug 2010 21:00:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Mormon Heretic</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[apostles]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[BYU]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[General Authorities]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[history]]></category>
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		<category><![CDATA[Mormon]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Mormons]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[politics]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[war]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=12375</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[There are a large majority of Mormons (especially here in Utah) that think the Church is wedded to the Republican Party.  A very interesting letter was read here in Utah on Mar 22, 2010 as Utah prepared for the upcoming Caucus Meetings. Let me quote something very interesting from the letter.  (The full text from the LDS Newsroom can be found here.) “Principles compatible with the gospel may be found in the platforms of various political parties.&#8221; (Emphasis mine.) Why does it seem that many Mormons don&#8217;t seem to believe this, despite the church&#8217;s oft-quoted emphasis that the church is politically neutral? On May 13, 1969, Elder Hugh B Brown of the First Presidency quoted John Gardner, former secretary of health, education, and welfare under Lyndon B. Johnson.  Gardner gave a very interesting definition of political extremism: Political extremism involves two prime ingredients: An excessively simple diagnosis of the world&#8217;s ills and a conviction that there are identifiable villains back of it all. . . . Blind belief in one&#8217;s cause and a low view of the morality of other Americans&#8211;these seem mild failings. But they are the soil in which ranker weeds take root . . . terrorism, and [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are a large majority of Mormons (especially here in Utah) that think the Church is wedded to the Republican Party.  A very interesting letter was read here in Utah on Mar 22, 2010 as Utah prepared for the upcoming Caucus Meetings. Let me quote something very interesting from the letter.  (The <a href="http://www.newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/news-releases-stories/first-presidency-letter-on-utah-precinct-caucus-meetings" target="_blank">full text from the LDS Newsroom can be found here</a>.)</p>
<blockquote><p>“Principles compatible with the gospel may be found in the platforms of <span style="text-decoration: underline;">various</span> political parties.&#8221; (Emphasis mine.)</p></blockquote>
<p>Why does it seem that many Mormons don&#8217;t seem to believe this, despite the church&#8217;s oft-quoted emphasis that the church is politically neutral?</p>
<p>On May 13, 1969, Elder Hugh B Brown of the First Presidency quoted John Gardner, former secretary of health, education, and welfare under Lyndon B. Johnson.  Gardner gave a very interesting definition of political extremism:<span id="more-12375"></span></p>
<blockquote><p>Political extremism involves two prime ingredients: An excessively simple diagnosis of the world&#8217;s ills and a conviction that there are identifiable villains back of it all. . . . Blind belief in one&#8217;s cause and a low view of the morality of other Americans&#8211;these seem mild failings. But they are the soil in which ranker weeds take root . . . terrorism, and the deep, destructive cleavages that paralyze a society.<span style="font-size: small;"><span>[<span style="font-family: 'ClassGarmnd BT'; font-size: x-small;">John Gardner, </span><span style="font-family: 'ClassGarmnd It BT'; font-size: x-small;">No Easy Victories </span><span style="font-family: 'ClassGarmnd BT'; font-size: x-small;">(New York: Harper and Row, 1969), 8, 9.]</span></span></span></p></blockquote>
<p>The text of Brown&#8217;s speech <a href="http://unicomm.byu.edu/president/documents/brown.htm" target="_blank">can be found here</a>.  Almost exactly one year prior to Brown&#8217;s speech referenced above, he delivered the Commencement Address at BYU in May 1968.  Most of you remember his now famous speech called &#8220;Profile of a Prophet.&#8221;  It&#8217;s a fantastic address as he outlines a legal argument to a Canadian judge on why Joseph Smith is a prophet.  I recently listened to the entire speech.</p>
<p>During the first 3 minutes of the speech, Brown gives a few jokes and advice, and then he gave a few words about Politics, before addressing his main topic of &#8220;Profile of a Prophet.&#8221;  I&#8217;d like to quote his words of advice to the graduating students.  I&#8217;d like to highlight some things I find particularly interesting.</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;You young people are leaving your university at a time in which our nation is engaged in an increasingly abrasive and strident process of electing a president. I wonder if you would permit me as one who has managed to survive a number of these events to pass on to you a few words of counsel.</p>
<p>First, I&#8217;d like you to be reassured that the <span style="text-decoration: underline;">leaders of both major political parties in this land are men of integrity</span>, and <span style="text-decoration: underline;">unquestioned patriotism</span>. <span style="text-decoration: underline;">Beware of those who</span> feel obliged to prove their own patriotism by calling into <span style="text-decoration: underline;">question the loyalty of others</span>. <span style="text-decoration: underline;">Be skeptical of those who</span> attempt to demonstrate their love of country by <span style="text-decoration: underline;">demeaning its institutions</span>. Know that men of <span style="text-decoration: underline;">both major political parties</span> who guide the nation’s executive, legislative, and judicial branches are <span style="text-decoration: underline;">men of unquestioned loyalty</span> and we should stand by and support them, and this <span style="text-decoration: underline;">refers not only to one party but to all</span>.</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Strive to develop a maturity</span> of mind and emotion and a depth of spirit which will enable you to differ with others on matters of politics without calling into question the integrity of those with whom you differ. <span style="text-decoration: underline;">Allow within the bounds of your definition of religious orthodoxy variation of political belief</span>. Do not have the temerity to dogmatize on issues where the Lord has seen fit to be silent. I&#8217;ve found by long experience that our two-party system is sound. Beware of those who are so lacking in humility, that they cannot come within the framework of one of our two great parties.</p>
<p>Our nation has avoided chaos, like that is gripping France today, because men have been able to temper their own desires sufficiently, seek broad agreement within one of the two major parties, rather than forming splinter groups around their one radical idea.</p>
<p>Our two party system has served us well, and should not be lightly discarded. At a time when radicals of right or left inflame race against race, avoid those who teach evil doctrines of racism. When our Father declared that we, his children, were brothers and sisters, he did not limit this relationship on the basis of race. Strive to develop that true love of country, that realizes that real patriotism must include within it a regard for the people of the rest of the globe. Patriotism has never demanded of good men hatred of another country as proof of one&#8217;s love for his own. Require the tolerance and compassion of others and for them. Those with different politics or race or religion will be demanded by the heavenly parentage which we all have in common.</p>
<p>-Hugh B. Brown, Commencement address, Brigham Young University, May 31, 1968</p></blockquote>
<p>I posted a slightly different version of this post <a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/2010/07/15/defining-political-extremism/" target="_blank">on my blog</a>.  The first few people commented that the politicians of the 1960&#8242;s must have been “Men of Integrity”, but our current politicians are not.  Let&#8217;s look at the 60&#8242;s for a moment.  Lyndon B Johnson&#8217;s ratings were so low, that he chose not to run for re-election.   Robert F Kennedy was shot and killed just 1 week after Elder Brown&#8217;s address, joining his brother John who had been shot and killed just a few years prior.  Martin Luther King Jr had been killed just 7 weeks prior to this address (on April 4.)</p>
<p>John F Kennedy had a reputation as a bit of a womanizer.  In 1968, Americans were quite sour on the VietNam War.  The sexual revolution was in full swing, and the Women&#8217;s Liberation movement was well under way.  The Bay of Pigs was a disaster in Cuba, and we had just gone through the Cuban Missile Crisis.  People were building bomb shelters for fear of Nuclear War with the USSR.  The Cold War was as cold as it ever was.  Suffice it to say, this decade was a time of tumult.</p>
<p>In the 1968 election that Brown referred to, Nixon won a 3 way race over D-Hubert Humphrey, and I-George Wallace. Let&#8217;s not forget that Wallace was later shot in 1972, and we all know what happened to Nixon. I didn&#8217;t know what happened in France in 1968, so <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_1968_in_France ">I looked it up on Wikipedia</a>. Apparently there were some big-time riots, strikes, and protests that almost brought the French government down.</p>
<p>I think it was a much more divisive time than today, though today is a very divisive time.  I don&#8217;t understand why our country has become so partisan, and why we don&#8217;t try to work together more.  People are gravitating to the extremes of MoveOn.org, and the Tea Party.  Brown saw a similar time of rancorous partisanship in the 60&#8242;s, and quoted Gardner:</p>
<blockquote><p>As these antagonisms become more intense, the pathology is much the same. . . . The ingredients are, first, a deep conviction on the part of the group as to its own limitless virtue or the overriding sanctity of its cause; second, grave doubts concerning the moral integrity of all others; third, a chronically aggrieved feeling that power has fallen into the hands of the unworthy (that is, the hands of others). . . .</p></blockquote>
<p>Politics can always bring out a lot of rants, and often both sides will have &#8220;grave doubts concerning the moral integrity of all others.&#8221;  I&#8217;m sure all of you have your pet political issues.  Can we avoid these antagonisms as we discuss the state of our country?</p>
<p>What say you?  Are you guilty of Elder Brown&#8217;s definition of political extremism?  Can you disagree with either President Bush or President Obama without questioning their integrity, just as Elder Brown did with Presidents Johnson, Kennedy, and Nixon?  Do you demean the institutions of the Congress or the Supreme Court because you don&#8217;t agree with particular legislation or court rulings?</p>
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		<slash:comments>166</slash:comments>
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		<title>A Schismatic End to the Mormon History Association meetings.</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/06/01/a-schismatic-end-to-the-mormon-history-association-meetings/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/06/01/a-schismatic-end-to-the-mormon-history-association-meetings/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jun 2010 18:01:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Mormon Heretic</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[apostles]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[community of christ]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[conferences and symposia]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[history]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[inter-faith]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[international]]></category>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=11470</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I attended the Mormon History Association meetings in Independence, Missouri this past week.  I thought I&#8217;d share some pictures.  If you&#8217;d like to read more about the conference, here are some links to my posts from Day 1, Day 2, and Day 3. CoC Independence Temple at Sunset All trip long, I have been looking forward to attending the Community of Christ Devotional at the Independence Temple.  The meeting began at 8:30 AM, and was a wonderful hour of singing and spoken word.  Professor Alex Baugh of BYU, and Apostle Susan Skoor of the Community of Christ CoC Apostle Susan Skoor gave background on many hymns written or revised by WW Phelps.  It was a truly inspiring meeting.  I haven’t enjoyed singing that much since I was in the MTC! Following the service, I went on a tour of the temple.  We visited the meditation chapel, as saw many beautiful sculptures inside the temple.  Unlike LDS temples, we were able to take photos everywhere except for the museum.  I was lucky enough to be led on a personal tour by Ron Romig, Community of Christ Director of the Kirtland Temple. Kirtland Temple Director Ron Romig Displayed in the museum were [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div>
<dl>
<dt>I attended the Mormon History Association meetings in Independence, Missouri this past week.  I thought I&#8217;d share some pictures.  If you&#8217;d like to read more about the conference, here are some links to my posts from <a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/2010/05/28/pres-veazey-and-john-hamer-highlights-of-mha-day-1/">Day 1</a>, <a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/2010/05/29/highlights-of-day-2-at-mha-trouble-in-zion-bushman-gordon-and-bringhurst-and-the-awards/">Day 2</a>, and <a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/2010/05/30/day-3-at-mha/">Day 3</a>.</dt>
<dt><a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/CoC-Independence-Temple2.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/CoC-Independence-Temple2-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a></dt>
<dd>CoC Independence Temple at Sunset</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<p><span id="more-11470"></span>All trip long, I have been looking forward to attending the Community of Christ Devotional at the Independence Temple.  The meeting began at 8:30 AM, and was a wonderful hour of singing and spoken word.  Professor Alex Baugh of BYU, and Apostle Susan Skoor of the Community of Christ</p>
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<dl>
<dt><a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Apostle-Susan-Skoor-CoC.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Apostle-Susan-Skoor-CoC-150x150.jpg" alt="you can see my shoulder" width="150" height="150" /></a></dt>
<dd>CoC Apostle Susan Skoor</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<p>gave background on many hymns written or revised by WW Phelps.  It was a truly inspiring meeting.  I haven’t enjoyed singing that much since I was in the MTC!</p>
<p><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-includes/js/tinymce/plugins/wordpress/img/trans.gif" alt="" />Following the service, I went on a tour of the temple.  We visited the meditation chapel, as saw many beautiful sculptures inside the temple.  Unlike LDS temples, we were able to take photos everywhere except for the museum.  I was lucky enough to be led on a personal tour by Ron Romig, Community of Christ Director of the Kirtland Temple.</p>
<div>
<dl>
<dt><a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Ron-Romig.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Ron-Romig-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a></dt>
<dd>Kirtland Temple Director Ron Romig</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<p>Displayed in the museum were actual copies of 1830, 1837, and 1840 copies of the Book of Mormon, along with facsimiles of the printer’s manuscript.  The famous oil painting of Joseph and Emma were also there, along with photos of the previous 6 or 7 prophet/presidents of the Community of Christ.  It was truly fascinating.</p>
<p>Following the tour, I wanted to visit some of the other Restoration churches.  There are quite a few Restoration churches in the vicinity.  When Joseph designed the city of Independence, he had allocated 63 acres for 24 temples to be erected on 3 city blocks.  The original plan called for 12 temples for the Melchizedek Priesthood, and 12 temples for the Aaronic Priesthood.  These temples apparently were supposed to serve a more administrative role than for worship.  As you can imagine, many followers of Joseph Smith, both inside and outside the LDS and RLDS churches have clamored for this land.</p>
<div>
<dl>
<dt><a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Temple-Lot2.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Temple-Lot2-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a></dt>
<dd>Temple Lot Church Building</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<p>A group calling itself the Church of Christ (Temple Lot) actually owns the location for the spot where Joseph Smith said a temple should reside, and they have a church on that location now.  The RLDS owns a portion o fthe temple lot, where the Independence Temple resides, and the LDS church owns a visitor’s center and a stake center on part of the temple lot.</p>
<p>I really would like to attend some of these other Restorationist branches, so it was difficult for me to choose where to go.  I attended part of the service for the Church of Christ (Temple Lot), also known as the Hedrickites.  The group was founded by a man by the name of Granville Hedrick.  There is an article in the Journal of Mormon History outlining many legal battles between the Hedrickites and the RLDS church, with the Hedrickites prevailing.  I attended about 20 minutes of the service.  During the service, a baby was blessed, and I heard references to both the Bible and Book of Mormon.  I was late for the service, but I did not see a sacrament table, so I’m not sure if that was part of the service.</p>
<div>
<dl>
<dt><a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Stone-church-2.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Stone-church-2-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a></dt>
<dd>Stone Church</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<p>Wanting to visit a few other churches, I attended the Stone Church—the oldest church in Independence. The RLDS church began construction in 1873 and it was dedicated in 1888.  I arrived just in time for the last song and prayer.  The church had a balcony, similar to the Salt Lake Tabernacle.  The congregation stood during the last song, and I was so tall that I had to duck into the aisle to see the organist.  There were old wooden benches there, but they had cushions.</p>
<div>
<dl>
<dt><a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Stone-Church-inside-2.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Stone-Church-inside-2-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a></dt>
<dd>You can see the balcony and benches</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<p>I asked if I could take photos, and they said I could.  There were 3 beautiful stained glass windows: one showing Moroni, Joseph Smith, and</p>
<div>
<dl>
<dt><a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Stone-Church-Moroni-2.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Stone-Church-Moroni-2-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a></dt>
<dd>Moroni with Gold Plates and Book of Mormon</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<p>the Golden Plates, another showing Moses, Jesus, and the resurrection, and a third symbolizing the Trinity.  The people were extremely friendly, and it was nice to have one of the members take me on a mini-tour.</p>
<div>
<dl>
<dt><a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Stone-Church-inside-3.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Stone-Church-inside-3-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a></dt>
<dd>view of Pipe Organ and podium in Stone Church</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<p>Following that service, I noticed another Community of Christ church a short distance away.  I was surprised to learn that they had a Jazz band playing.  I recorded a few minutes of their last song!  (I tried to post it, but the file is too big&#8211;I&#8217;ll try to condense it somehow.)  They mentioned that the neighborhood was full of drugs and gangs, and they were trying to help citizens in the area avoid these problems.  They invited me back next week for a baby blessing, but I told them I had a plane to catch.</p>
<div>
<dl>
<dt><a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/CoC-Jazz-church.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/CoC-Jazz-church-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a></dt>
<dd>They have a Jazz band for church services</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<p>A friend told me that I really needed to attend the Cutlerite Church.  It was founded in 1853 by Alphaeus Cutler, who I believe is mentioned in the D&amp;C.  On my way there, I mistakenly thought this was a Cutlerite church.</p>
<div>
<dl>
<dt><a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Small-Church.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Small-Church-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a></dt>
<dd>Not sure of origins, but I&#8217;m pretty sure it is Mormon&#8211;I may call the number to find out</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<p>I knocked on the door, but nobody answered.</p>
<div>
<dl>
<dt><a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Small-Church3.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Small-Church3-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a></dt>
<dd>Bigger view of this &#8220;Restored&#8221; church</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<p>Just a few houses down was the real Cutlerite church.  My friend told me that the Cutlerites are the only group that still maintains an Endowment Ceremony, and it is conducted in the upstairs portion of this church.</p>
<div>
<dl>
<dt><a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Cutlerite-sign.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Cutlerite-sign-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a></dt>
<dd>founded by Alphaeus Cutler 1853</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<p>Apparently they only have about 10-15 people meet on a weekly basis.  The MHA pre-conference tour flooded them with about 50 interested participants.</p>
<div>
<dl>
<dt><a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Cutlerite.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Cutlerite-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a></dt>
<dd>Cutlerite Chapel</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<p>Unfortunately, I arrived too late: the doors were locked.  Here are a few photos, and I stuck my camera up to the door to peer into the chapel.</p>
<div>
<dl>
<dt><a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Cutlerite-chapel2.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Cutlerite-chapel2-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a></dt>
<dd>Cutlerite Chapel</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<p>As I looked at my map, I decided to try to find Lilburn W Boggs house.  Unfortunately, I never found it, but I did find another interesting church: the Remnant Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.  <a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Remnant-logo.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Remnant-logo-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a>They meet across the street from the Independence Temple in a converted high school (formerly Crisman High School.)  I walked around the building, and discovered a man.  Apparently, they hold luncheons for the needy and homeless.  Their freezer had broken, so he was loading food into his van.  I asked him if I might be able to tour the building, and he reluctantly agreed.  His name is Arlo Stevenson.</p>
<div>
<dl>
<dt><a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Arlo-Stevenson-House-of-Aaron.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Arlo-Stevenson-House-of-Aaron-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a></dt>
<dd>Arlo Stevenson of the House of Aaron</dd>
</dl>
</div>
<p>I learned that he is not a member of the Remnant Church, but his church has partnered with them to help out the needy.  The Remnant Church is a break-off from the RLDS church.  Arlo is a former member of the RLDS church, but has joined the House of Aaron, and I learned that this church has a branch about 50 miles west of Delta, Utah on the Utah/Nevada border.  Arlo showed me the Remnant Church offices, and then I learned that the Remnant Church has rented a room for the House of Aaron to hold meetings.  I purchased a “Sunday School” manual, and I hope to do a future post on the House of Aaron.</p>
<p>I also ran into some interesting people.  I had a nice chat on Saturday night with Paul Savage, Apostle of the Church of Jesus Christ of the Elijah message.  He is from Independence as well, and has a small congregation.  I had recently purchased <a href="http://www.johnwhitmerbooks.com/books/details_SOS.asp" target="_blank">Scattering of the Saints</a> by John Hamer<a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Joseph-Smith-and-John-Hamer.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Joseph-Smith-and-John-Hamer-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a>and Newell Bringhurst, and he pointed to the cover to his name.  I said, “Wow, I thought these were all dead people.”</p>
<p>“I’m not dead!” he exclaimed.  He was a really interesting person.  We didn’t have much time to chat, but I got his email address and hope to discuss this group further as I learn more.</p>
<p>I also took my picture with 2 apostles from the Community of Christ:  Andrew Bolton and Susan Skoor.  Here is Elder Marlin Jensen, Historian for the LDS church.  <a href="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Elder-Marlin-Jensen-LDS-His.jpg"><img src="http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Elder-Marlin-Jensen-LDS-His-150x150.jpg" alt="" width="150" height="150" /></a>I was pleased to meet many authors including John Hamer, Newell Bringhurst, Kathy Daines, Rick Turley (asst LDS Church Historian), and Greg Prince.  It was a real blast—I remarked to some that Independence felt a bit like Mormon Disneyland to me.</p>
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		<title>The Death of McConkie&#8217;s Mormon Doctrine</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/05/20/the-death-of-mcconkies-mormon-doctrine/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/05/20/the-death-of-mcconkies-mormon-doctrine/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 May 2010 17:19:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Bored in Vernal</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[apostles]]></category>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=11320</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Last night on KUTV in Utah, an announcement was made which signals the end of an era.  It was reported that Bruce R. McConkie&#8217;s Mormon Doctrine will no longer be published by the Church, and that it will not be sold by Deseret Book.  Since I didn&#8217;t see the newscast, I&#8217;m not sure what reasons were given, but one viewer stated, &#8220;Why? For tighter correlative control, because of the book&#8217;s embarrassing clarity, and because of some controversial assertions in the book.&#8221;  He also said that the publisher asserted the book was withdrawn because of poor sales. Sandra Tanner was interviewed on the 5:30 segment of the news, with her collection of every edition of McConkie&#8217;s book.  She provided me with her view of the decision: I believe the main reason McConkie&#8217;s &#8220;Mormon Doctrine&#8221; was taken out of print was due to its candid discussion of LDS doctrines that the church is now trying to hide. Such teachings as God once being a man, his wife&#8211;Heavenly Mother, and Jesus being the literal, physical son of God are just a few of the doctrines that are being minimized in current manuals. If the LDS Church felt &#8220;Mormon Doctrine&#8221; presented a faulty compilation [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><img class="alignleft" style="margin-left: 10px; margin-right: 10px;" src="http://www.gospelink.com/images/books/569.jpg" alt="" width="124" height="180" />Last night on KUTV in Utah, an announcement was made which signals the end of an era.  It was reported that Bruce R. McConkie&#8217;s <em>Mormon Doctrine</em> will no longer be published by the Church, and that it will not be sold by Deseret Book.  Since I didn&#8217;t see the newscast, I&#8217;m not sure what reasons were given, but one viewer stated, &#8220;Why? For tighter correlative control, because of the book&#8217;s embarrassing clarity, and because of some controversial assertions in the book.&#8221;  He also said that the publisher asserted the book was withdrawn because of poor sales.<span id="more-11320"></span><!--more--></p>
<p>Sandra Tanner was interviewed on the 5:30 segment of the news, with her collection of every edition of McConkie&#8217;s book.  She provided me with her view of the decision:</p>
<blockquote><p><em>I believe the main reason McConkie&#8217;s &#8220;Mormon Doctrine&#8221; was taken out of print was due to its candid discussion of LDS doctrines that the church is now trying to hide. Such teachings as God once being a man, his wife&#8211;Heavenly Mother, and Jesus being the literal, physical son of God are just a few of the doctrines that are being minimized in current manuals. If the LDS Church felt &#8220;Mormon Doctrine&#8221; presented a faulty compilation of their doctrines, why haven&#8217;t they issued an authorized compendium of their beliefs? Mormons often say to me, &#8220;That&#8217;s not official doctrine&#8221; as though there was some place to look up the official teachings. Where is the official systematic theology of Mormonism?</em></p></blockquote>
<p>Interestingly, <a href="http://connect2utah.com/">KUTV has posted</a> their news stories from last night online, omitting any mention of this segment.  There is speculation that it was held due to criticism of the way it was reported.  We will update you here as more details become available.</p>
<p>Written in 1958, <em>Mormon Doctrine</em> has served as a reference book for members of the Church for over 50 years, but has recently gone out of vogue.  References to McConkie&#8217;s work were taken out of the Gospel Principles manual when it was reissued this year for use in Priesthood and Relief Society classes.  Now it seems it is being further phased out.  It is only surprising that this has not been done before, since <em>Mormon Doctrine</em> has not enjoyed the support of every member of the highest Church Councils over the years.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d like to hold a little &#8220;In Memoriam&#8221; session here at Mormon Matters for Bruce R. McConkie&#8217;s <em>Mormon Doctrine</em>.  It was the first book I ever purchased when a brand-new convert in 1979, in the authoritative-looking black-and-gold binding. It was the perfect place for a convert to go for a source of Church teachings in a pre-internet age.  Thus, it shaped much of my early thinking about the Church.  This was the third edition, having been revised to be &#8220;more moderate&#8221; in 1966, and then again in 1978 after the Priesthood revelation.  Much of the Bible Dictionary in our current editions of the LDS scriptures come directly from <em>Mormon Doctrine</em>.  McConkie himself described it as &#8220;the first major attempt to digest, explain, and analyze all of the important doctrines of the kingdom&#8221; and &#8220;the first extensive compendium of the whole gospel—the first attempt to publish an encyclopedic commentary covering the whole field of revealed religion.&#8221;  Its teachings have had a major impact upon several generations of Latter-day Saints.</p>
<p>How have you been impacted by Mormon Doctrine?</p>
<h4><strong>Update</strong>: The story is now up at <a href="http://connect2utah.com/news-story/?nxd_id=89525">Connect2Utah</a>.</h4>
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		<slash:comments>126</slash:comments>
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		<item>
		<title>A Non-Historical View of the Book of Mormon</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/05/15/some-members-want-to-openly-support-a-non-historical-view-of-the-book-of-mormon/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/05/15/some-members-want-to-openly-support-a-non-historical-view-of-the-book-of-mormon/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 May 2010 06:04:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>James</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Anti-Mormon]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[apostasy]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[apostles]]></category>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=11020</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Perhaps the time has come in the church to recognize that some members want to openly espouse a non historical view of the Book of Mormon? My daughter Bethany and her friend Clare have recently gone to the Community of Christ Church. They enjoyed it and said the members were very open and friendly but the church at least here in the UK didn’t seem anything like our Brighamite version of the church. I understand that many of their high ranking members don’t view the book of Mormon as historical. Some members feel it&#8217;s historical; some feel it’s inspired, and some would like to see it jettisoned from the canon of scripture. I thought it was quite courageous of their leaders to consult with historians and look at the facts as they see them and to seek and follow what they felt was God’s will, doing all of this by common consent with the members in their church. One of their members Wayne Ham did a summary report (below) called Problems in Interpreting the Book of Mormon as History! But before you read his report please take the following quiz: [poll id="171"] [poll id="172"] [poll id="173"] [poll id="174"] [poll id="175"] Please [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Book-of-mormon.jpg"><img class="alignnone size-full wp-image-11021" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Book-of-mormon.jpg" alt="" width="349" height="253" /></a></p>
<p>Perhaps the time has come in the church to recognize that some members want to openly espouse a non historical view of the Book of Mormon?<span id="more-11020"></span></p>
<p>My daughter Bethany and her friend Clare have recently gone to the Community of Christ Church. They enjoyed it and said the members were very open and friendly but the church at least here in the UK didn’t seem anything like our Brighamite version of the church.</p>
<p>I understand that many of their high ranking members don’t view the book of Mormon as historical. Some members feel it&#8217;s historical; some feel it’s inspired, and some would like to see it jettisoned from the canon of scripture.</p>
<p>I thought it was quite courageous of their leaders to consult with historians and look at the facts as they see them and to seek and follow what they felt was God’s will, doing all of this by common consent with the members in their church.</p>
<p>One of their members Wayne Ham did a summary report (below) called <em>Problems in Interpreting the Book of Mormon as History!</em> But before you read his report please take the following quiz:</p>
<p>[poll id="171"]</p>
<p>[poll id="172"]</p>
<p>[poll id="173"]</p>
<p>[poll id="174"]</p>
<p>[poll id="175"]</p>
<p>Please read if you can all of Wayne Ham&#8217;s <a href="http://www.thecybercommunity.net/publish/stories.php?story=05/07/02/1025297">Problems in Interpreting the Book of Mormon as History </a>from the Community of  Christ Web Page.  Below are some selections from Ham&#8217;s paper which I highly recommend you read if you have the time:</p>
<blockquote><p>The origin and destiny of the [so-called] &#8220;Red Man&#8221; were among the chief topics for speculation and discussion on the early nineteenth century American frontier. The presence of many Indian burial mounds in the Great Lakes region was a constant source of curiosity for the settlers in that region. In 1823 Ethan Smith, a Vermont pastor, published a book entitled View of the Hebrews: or the Ten Tribes of Israel in America.</p>
<p>Those who received the Book of Mormon from the hands of eager missionaries were urged not only to assent to the narrative as a historical account of the Indians&#8217; ancestory, but also to accept the book as evidence that God had broken the silence of centuries to restore his church to the earth by means of a young prophet. Many of the early Latter Day Saint believers took an all-or-nothing approach.  If the Book of Mormon was true, the religion expounded by its author and proprietor was true also. If the book should ever prove to be false, all validity for the restoration movement would necessarily have to be disclaimed.</p>
<p>The book immediately attained a canonical status in the minds of the Latter Day Saints that made literal acceptance of it as the revelation of God to the ancient Americans a matter of faith. As far as church members were concerned, the book was impervious to any kind of critical investigation and judgment.</p>
<p>As modern historical and textual scholarship in the realm of biblical studies became increasing appreciated and influential at the grassroots level in the late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries, and thus known to some extent to Latter Day Saints, a defensive reaction set in among some church members, resulting in some stiff resistance to allowing the tools of this scholarship to be applied to the church&#8217;s understandings of the Book of Mormon. Thus Book of Mormon studies in the past have been characterized by polemics, apologetics, and amateur archaeological surveys whenever the concern has moved beyond merely exploring the intricate details of the very complex narrative of migrations, wars, and religious revivals among the Book of Mormon peoples.</p>
<p>Because the temper of our times is such that no movement nor institution nor book can forever remain impervious to the searchlight of scholarly inspection, out times demand that all the rudiments of religious faith be subjected to the scrutiny of reason and empirical research.</p>
<p>As the Book of Mormon is examined without any intention solely to amass data to support preconceived notions about it, certain problems concerning traditional understanding of the books stand out. These problems include:</p>
<p>1<strong>. The story of its coming forth</strong>. The actual events culminating in the publication of the book are, as of now, quite irrecoverable in that it is impossible to distill a unified account from all the primary and secondary reports.</p>
<p>2. <strong>Identifying the book&#8217;s narrative with a particular time and space</strong>. Extravagant claims about ancient American archaeology supporting the Book of Mormon have been made. Toltec, Mayan and even Aztec ruins, all of a comparatively late period, have been unfortunately identified with Book of Mormon peoples.</p>
<p>3, <strong>The book&#8217;s propensity for reflecting in detail the religious concerns of the American frontier</strong>. Alexander Campbell in 1831 pointed out that every major theological question of the frontier was covered in the Book of Mormon, including infant baptism, ordination and ministerial authority, the trinity, regeneration, the fall of man, the atonement, transubstantiation, fasting, penance, church government, religious experience, the general resurrection, eternal punishment, and even the burning question of Freemasonry, republican government and the rights of man.</p>
<p>4<strong>. The Christological perspective of the book</strong>. To some students of theology, it would appear that there is a marked incongruity between the Christ Event of the New Testament and the Christ Event of the Book of Mormon.</p>
<p>5. <strong>The book&#8217;s ethical implications, when viewed as universally binding upon all men</strong>. Some Latter Day Saints, in talking of the Book of Mormon as the &#8220;fullness of the gospel&#8221; (D. &amp; C. 17:2), believe that the book reveals the will of God more perfectly than any other resource we possess. Moreover they would assert that the transmission process involved in preserving and bringing forth the book would bypass many of the scribal errors to which the Bible was admittedly vulnerable.</p>
<p>6. <strong>The use of biblical scripture and ideas as sources</strong>. Several sizeable sections of the King James Version of the Bible are found in the Book of Mormon, including twenty-one chapters of Isaiah, the Sermon on the Mount, the Ten Commandments, Malachi 3 and 4, I Corinthians 12:1-11 and Acts 3:22-26. In addition to such full-fledged quotations, the Book of Mormon is replete with short biblical expressions. John Hyde counted 298 biblical snatches from the New Testament alone in the first 428 pages of the first edition of the Book of Mormon.</p>
<p>8<strong>. The matter of Book of Mormon anachronisms</strong>. Those who approach the Book of Mormon with the view of proving it to be essentially what it seems to claim to be–a record of the history of ancient Americans who lived between 2200 BC and AD 400–immediately find themselves having to deal with the problem of anachronisms.</p>
<p>9. <strong>The changes in the Book of Mormon</strong>. While the book itself confesses the possibility of errors, many claims concerning the verbal accuracy of the book have long been made by Book of Mormon adherents. Joseph Smith himself at one time state that &#8220;the Book of Mormon was the most correct of any book on earth.&#8221; Modern Microfilm Company of Salt Lake City has recently published a work documenting 3,913 changes in the Book of Mormon since its first printing.</p>
<p><strong>Conclusions.</strong> None of the above problems areas &#8220;disprove&#8221; the Book of Mormon. They do, however, raise some questions about our traditional understandings concerning the book. Perhaps for some church members answers to the questions raised in this article would seem to be readily available. For others, however, quick and easy answers will not solve the dilemma. Perhaps the time has come in the church to recognize that some members want to openly espouse a non-literal view of the Book of Mormon, treating it as a non-historical treatise in much the same manner as modern critics view the books of Jonah, Ruth, Job, and Daniel in the Old Testament. Freed from some of the traditional hang-ups involved with having to accept unquestioningly the historicity of the Book of Mormon, these members could then read the book as a product of the Restoration movement in the nineteenth century, perhaps thus &#8220;enjoying&#8221; this fascinating piece of literature for the very first time.</p></blockquote>
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		<title>After Action Report: The Community of Christ Did WHAT?</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/04/21/after-action-report-the-community-of-christ-did-what/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/04/21/after-action-report-the-community-of-christ-did-what/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Apr 2010 18:45:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>FireTag</dc:creator>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=10678</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Headline in the Independence Examiner for Thursday, April 15, 2010: &#8220;Delegation Takes No Action on Human Sexuality Issues: Church Will Continue Dialogue.&#8221; Headline  by John Hamer on BCC on Thursday, April 15, 2010: &#8220;Gay Rights Revelation Added to The Community of Christ D&#38;C&#8221; &#8212;&#8212;&#8212;- The two headlines above generally cover the spectrum of opinion about what happened at the Community of Christ World Conference as it completed the process of canonization of a new Section 164 for its D&#38;C. The spectrum of opinions about whether what happened was a good thing or bad thing, of course, runs even more broadly. Indeed, I’m not at all certain that we’ll even be able to see how intense the various “colors” of that spectrum will prove until information about the conference filters down to the bulk of the North American church that maintains no real connection to the World Church in the &#8220;Blogitorium&#8221;. As in many churches on the Christian left in North America, that membership tends to be somewhat more traditionalist than its leadership. Nevertheless, I’ll give my view as someone from one part of the peanut gallery, focusing on what was in each portion of Section 164 and the effects of [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Headline in the <em>Independence</em><em> Examiner </em>for Thursday, April 15, 2010:</p>
<p><strong><em>&#8220;Delegation Takes No Action on Human Sexuality Issues: Church Will Continue Dialogue.&#8221;</em></strong></p>
<p>Headline  <a href="http://bycommonconsent.com/2010/04/15/gay-rights-revelation-added-to-dc-world-conference-part-2-april-12%e2%80%9315/">by John Hamer on BCC </a> on Thursday, April 15, 2010:</p>
<p><strong><em>&#8220;Gay Rights Revelation Added to The Community of Christ D&amp;C&#8221;</em></strong></p>
<p><strong><em>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;-</em></strong></p>
<p>The two headlines above generally cover the spectrum of opinion about what happened at the Community of Christ World Conference as it completed the <a href="http://mormonmatters.org/2010/01/05/canonizing-modern-revelation-a-tourist-guide/"> process of canonization</a> of a <a href="http://cofchrist.org/dc164/"> new Section 164</a> for its D&amp;C. The spectrum of opinions about whether what happened was a good thing or bad thing, of course, runs even more broadly. Indeed, I’m not at all certain that we’ll even be able to see how intense the various “colors” of that spectrum will prove until information about the conference filters down to the bulk of the North American church that maintains no real connection to the World Church <a href="http://saintsherald.com/2010/04/13/world-conference-in-the-blogosphere/"> in the &#8220;Blogitorium&#8221;</a>. As in many churches on the Christian left in North America, that membership tends to be somewhat more traditionalist than its leadership.<span id="more-10678"></span></p>
<p>Nevertheless, I’ll give my view as someone from one part of the peanut gallery, focusing on what was in each portion of Section 164 and the effects of associated legislation passed to begin implementation. A future post will provide a similar analysis on legislation considered by the Conference not specifically addressed by Section 164 and suggest something about the overall direction of the Community of Christ in the future.</p>
<p><strong><span style="text-decoration: underline">SECTION 164, PARAGRAPHS 1-4</span></strong></p>
<p>President Veazey describes the experiences of meditation, particularly on portions of Galatians 3:27-29, that led him to offer the Section. After commending the church for similarly seeking to discern the Spirit in a structured process that has been going on for well over a year, he makes explicit an understanding of the church and its sacraments which has been implicit in CofChrist theology for a number of years.</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;&#8230;Instruction given previously about baptism was proper to ensure the rise and cohesiveness of the church during its early development and in following years. However, as a growing number have come to understand, the redemptive action of God in Christ—while uniquely and authoritatively expressed through the church—is not confined solely to the church. God’s grace, revealed in Jesus Christ, freely moves throughout creation, often beyond human perception, to achieve divine purposes in people’s lives.&#8221;</p></blockquote>
<p>The Community of Christ is to see itself as “one true church”, not as the “one <em><span style="text-decoration: underline">and only</span></em> true church”. How serious is this theological intent was earlier signaled by something I haven’t seen commentators note elsewhere. The first sessions of Conference always feature certain speeches of welcome. One is usually a non-CofChrist speaker. This speaker is often a local Congressman or a Missouri Senator. The speech is strictly non-political even then, but the identity is interesting because trends over time seem to show the direction of the church leadership’s interest.</p>
<p>This year that slot went to the Rev. Dr. Michael Kinnamon, General Secretary of the National Council of Churches. Kinnamon unabashedly spoke of the Community of Christ having unique gifts that should be seen as adding to bodies such as the NCC, rather than as a body going its own way. Ironically, contacts between the RLDS and the NCC were among the suspicions cited by fundamentalist opponents of the church circa 1970 as evidence of apostasy. Thus, such a speech 40 years ago might itself have been too controversial to occur.</p>
<p>Section 164 then lays out specific instruction (that will be followed quickly by formal administrative policy <a href="http://www.cofchrist.org/wc2010/counsel/QA3.asp"> guidance</a> to become effective by September 1, 2011). These policies will result in acceptance into membership into the Community of Christ upon confirmation by CofChrist priesthood – without requiring rebaptism if the original baptism: a) involved water;  b) was performed by an ordained Christian minister;  and c) as a personal expression of faith in Christ. In particular, we will not require someone to present proof of their baptism <em>or the baptizing minister’s credentials</em>, since that would be impossible in many places throughout the world. This clearly expands the notion of <em>true priesthood authority</em> beyond the boundaries of those called through the priesthood line passed to Joseph Smith.</p>
<p>The phrase “using water” also allows for baptisms done by immersion, pouring, or sprinkling, while upholding the church’s own standard practice of baptism by immersion at the age of accountability. There is also some additional specific guidance regarding the substance of the prayer of confirmation (Baptism of the Spirit) that is now the means by which one moves from being part of the Body of Christ into membership within the denomination. And preparation for confirmation will now be a formal requirement for the ordinance to occur.</p>
<p>Paragraph 3 contains a call for all members to serious consider and live the meaning of their baptismal covenants (water and Spirit). Paragraph 4 ties this call to consideration of the role the sacrament of the Lord’s Supper should play in renewing, witnessing, and amplifying our covenant. (Portions of the preamble specifically warn us to NOT make the meaning of the covenants atrophy even as we broaden the procedures, because of the concern that in some places this has happened with open communion).</p>
<p>This portion of the Section makes the Community of Christ look very Protestant – if you can call becoming more Protestant through modern revelation a Protestant concept in the first place.</p>
<p><strong><span style="text-decoration: underline">SECTION 164, PARAGRAPHS 5-7</span></strong></p>
<p>These are the paragraphs whose approval generated the widely divergent headlines above. Their actual content is to call attention to “serious questions about moral behavior and relationships” – but to prioritize those questions not simply as they are listed within the dominant culture of the denomination.</p>
<blockquote><p><em>“These issues are complex and difficult to understand outside their particular settings because of strikingly different cultural histories, customs, and understandings of scripture. For example, the issues include female submission, female genital mutilation, child brides, forced marriages, and sexual permissiveness. They include cleansing and exploitation of widows, harsh conflicts over same-gender attraction and relationships, and varying legal, religious, and social definitions of marriage, to name just a few.&#8221;</em></p></blockquote>
<p>More importantly, the Section calls us to see the solutions for these moral dilemmas as arising from an understanding of Christianity as a community that transcends definitions by economic status, social class, sex, gender, or ethnicity. They simply are no longer primary. Relationships are to be rooted in the principles of Christ-like love, mutual respect, responsibility, justice, covenant, and faithfulness, <em>against which there is no law.</em></p>
<p>Section 164 then extrapolates that these principles require that the church move the resolution of moral issues to the church in the cultures most affected by them rather than let the dominant North American church decide for the rest of the world. Field Apostles, under the guidance of the Presidency, are authorized to call and set the agenda for field, national, or (non-geographical) cultural groups to deal with issues such as those listed above as they feel directed.</p>
<p>Uncertainty about the nature and timing of these conferences is generating the widely divergent headlines about gay rights. First, everyone in the Community of Christ seems to understand that the leadership feels that it must not expose our leaders and members in cultures where discussion of gay issues is taboo. If so, they can hardly move toward expanded gay rights in the United States unless they can find a way to maintain what the government would call “plausible deniability&#8221;.</p>
<p>Second, there is a large body of conservative members in the US church (and non-members in society) whose reaction must be anticipated and allowed for. The LDS experience with Prop 8 shows what happens when the church in the US takes any position on controversial issues in the political arena. Many feel the church has moved too hesitantly and will continue to do so; others are likely to feel the church is moving in the wrong direction entirely.</p>
<p>Finally, there are logistical questions. It seems unlikely that the US church has the resources to assemble a national conference on gay rights issues before the spring of 2012 at the earliest. It will take until September, 2011, simply to implement the new conditions for membership.</p>
<p>The greatest sign of movement toward gay rights comes from something in administrative minutia. It is normal for the church to realign Apostolic Fields following a World Conference (our Apostles retire, so there are usually changes in the Twelve). This time a gerrymandered field has been carved out for Apostle Susan Skoor that stretches from Southern Australia to Eastern  Canada – and just happens to cover all of the non-US jurisdictions that proposed World Conference legislation expanding full priesthood and sacramental rites for gays. The extension of rights in that Field or in nations within that Field <em>might be granted</em> while maintaining sufficient distance from the World Church (and prying media) to protect the church in cultures hostile to gay rights.</p>
<p>Expansion to the US is much more difficult to do while maintaining any credibility to foreign governments and religious bodies that “this is just local jurisdictions acting on their own.&#8221;</p>
<p>Perhaps more significantly in the long run than the particular moral issues – at least from the perspective of this Washington spectator – is the change these paragraphs make in the legislative rights of mission centers to set the agenda for the church. The Presidency immediately ruled 21 legislative proposals that had been painstakingly brought to the conference as out of order because they reflect National or Regional concerns. These rulings were entirely appropriate under Section 164 guidance.</p>
<p>However, the Conference later passed implementing legislation for the field and national conferences that make them “special conferences”. Such conferences operate under different parliamentary rules than World Conference. In particular,  Mission Centers lack the right to place items on the agenda of special conferences; that agenda is set <em>only</em> by the Apostle who calls the conference with the approval of the Presidency. In short, this revelation makes the Community of Christ less democratic and more theocratic than it was a year ago.</p>
<p><strong><span style="text-decoration: underline">SECTION 164, PARAGRAPH 8</span></strong></p>
<p>Paragraph 8, by contrast, shows the flexibility and speed with which the Community of Christ can move on organizational issues when it wishes to do so. The Twelve and the Presidents of the Seven Quorums of Seventy have been meeting for several years in response to the immediately previous revelation (Section 163) to consider organizational changes to increase evangelistic effectiveness. Paragraph 8 is taken as authorization to make these changes.</p>
<p>Within 24 hours of Section 164 approval, the number of Quorums of Seventy was increased from seven to ten, the additional Quorum Presidents were named, and they were approved by the Conference and set apart to that calling. Jack Bauer couldn&#8217;t have moved faster. Clearly, the outcome of these discussions among the leading quorums was well prepared in advance, while they are still feeling their way around the notion of how and when national conferences will function.</p>
<p>Reorganization of the Twelve, while not fundamental, essentially separates the world into 10 Fields for the moment, each led by an Apostle, with the remaining two Apostles focusing on Headquarters-oriented tasks. For the first time, a single Quorum of Seventy will be aligned with the geographic or other missionary focus of a Field Apostle.</p>
<p><strong><span style="text-decoration: underline">SECTION 164, PARAGRAPH 9</span></strong></p>
<p>The final paragraph of the document is a benediction of sorts, and a challenge that the rise of Zion is no farther away than the willingness of all of us – all the “beloved children of the Restoration” – to overcome our insecurities and embrace a Christ-like life.</p>
<blockquote><p><em>&#8220;The mission of Jesus Christ is what matters most to the journet ahead.&#8221;</em></p></blockquote>
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		<title>Bombshell at the BYU Studies Symposium</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/03/13/bombshell-at-the-byu-studies-symposium/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/03/13/bombshell-at-the-byu-studies-symposium/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Mar 2010 14:00:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Bored in Vernal</dc:creator>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=10082</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[A small crowd at the BYU Studies Symposium yesterday was on hand to receive Richard Holzapfel&#8217;s self-proclaimed Mormon history &#8220;bombshell.&#8221;  He presented the morning plenary session on Wilford Woodruff&#8217;s 1897 recorded testimony, the first sound recording made of an LDS General Authority.  The audience was treated to hearing parts of this recording, which is also available at the BYU Studies website. This recording forms part of the many testimonies that are available from Wilford Woodruff concerning &#8220;the Last Charge,&#8221; a council meeting in Nauvoo where the Twelve were given authority to &#8220;bear off the kingdom,&#8221; and interpreted by President Woodruff to be the foundation of the succession policy of the Church.  Holzapfel&#8217;s announcement was that on one of the three wax cylinders upon which the recording was made, the rest of the First Presidency consisting of George Q. Cannon and Joseph F. Smith added their witnesses that they had heard Wilford Woodruff bear his testimony.  We thus have the early voice of another president of the Church, the only recording of Cannon, and the addition of &#8220;two or three witnesses&#8221; to respond to the succession question. I guess you&#8217;d really have to be a Mormon history afficionado to consider this [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/c51.jpg"><img class="alignleft size-thumbnail wp-image-7683" title="Avatar-BiV" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/c51-150x150.jpg" alt="Avatar-BiV" width="80" height="80" /></a>A small crowd at the BYU Studies Symposium yesterday was on hand to receive Richard Holzapfel&#8217;s self-proclaimed Mormon history &#8220;bombshell.&#8221;  He presented the morning plenary session on Wilford Woodruff&#8217;s 1897 recorded testimony, the first sound recording made of an LDS General Authority.  The audience was treated to hearing parts of this recording, which is also available at the <a href="http://byustudies.byu.edu/showTitle.aspx?title=166">BYU Studies website</a>.<span id="more-10082"></span></p>
<p>This recording forms part of the many testimonies that are available from Wilford Woodruff concerning &#8220;the Last Charge,&#8221; a council meeting in Nauvoo where the Twelve were given authority to &#8220;bear off the kingdom,&#8221; and interpreted by President Woodruff to be the foundation of the succession policy of the Church.  Holzapfel&#8217;s announcement was that on one of the three wax cylinders upon which the recording was made, the rest of the First Presidency consisting of George Q. Cannon and Joseph F. Smith added their witnesses that they had heard Wilford Woodruff bear his testimony.  We thus have the early voice of another president of the Church, the only recording of Cannon, and the addition of &#8220;two or three witnesses&#8221; to respond to the succession question.</p>
<p>I guess you&#8217;d really have to be a Mormon history afficionado to consider this information a &#8220;bombshell.&#8221;  There were a select few in the audience who were moved by the revelation, but the majority took the news calmly.  Holzapfel, in contrast, could hardly restrain himself as he built up his presentation and delivered his revelation in the final moments.  He mentioned that he had difficulty waiting the few weeks before the symposium to tell anyone this exciting news.</p>
<p>Interestingly, a point was mentioned in passing which grabbed my attention far more than the recording.  Apparently Holzapfel and some other historians have recently collaborated on an article discussing for the first time the fact that Sidney Rigdon was not present in the morning meetings at the Nauvoo Temple on March 26, 1844, when the Last Charge was given.  This is stunningly important to Mormon history, because it implies that Rigdon was not given the same keys that the rest of the Twelve received at that time.  Not only did he lack the right to succession, but he may not have understood the pattern Joseph presented that day in the same way as the members of the Twelve who were present.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m enjoying the Symposium so far, and I&#8217;ll be back to summarize some more of the proceedings soon.</p>
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		<title>Prophets, Seers and Bureaucrats</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/03/08/prophets-seers-and-bureaucrats/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/03/08/prophets-seers-and-bureaucrats/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Mar 2010 06:45:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Aaron R. aka Rico</dc:creator>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=9670</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I listened recently to a Mormon Expression podcast with John Dehlin, in which he comments upon the difficult position the Church leaders face.  He observes that their are times when they make particular decisions based upon a legalistic-bureaucratic framework that sometimes seem incomprehensible, even unchristian but that these decision are understandable. I would like to ask this question: Is there an alternative? Quinn argues that during the explosive Church growth of the 1950’s-1970’s the Church attempted to draw upon a number of external influences in making the organization more efficient and effective.  At the same time there was an explosive growth in Church bureaucracy.  This led some to become concerned over the influence and direction of power and authority within the hierarchical structure. According to Quinn, both J. Reuben Clark Jr. and David O. McKay were concerned that the increasing bureaucratic, financial and organizational burden meant that the GA’s were not able (due to lack of knowledge or expertise) to make decisions that would need to be made.  They would, of necessity, have to rely upon technocrats and other specialists from the various sub-committees at Church Headquarters.  President McKay’s concern was that this movement would involve an ecclesiastical abdication of the God-given authority to led [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I listened recently to a Mormon Expression podcast with <a href="http://mormonstories.org/?p=788">John Dehlin</a>, in which he comments upon the difficult position the Church leaders face.  He observes that their are times when they make particular decisions based upon a legalistic-bureaucratic framework that sometimes seem incomprehensible, even unchristian but that these decision are understandable. I would like to ask this question: Is there an alternative?<span id="more-9670"></span></p>
<p>Quinn argues that during the explosive Church growth of the 1950’s-1970’s the Church attempted to draw upon a number of external influences in making the organization more efficient and effective.  At the same time there was an explosive growth in Church bureaucracy.  This led some to become concerned over the influence and direction of power and authority within the hierarchical structure.</p>
<p>According to Quinn, both J. Reuben Clark Jr. and David O. McKay were concerned that the increasing bureaucratic, financial and organizational burden meant that the GA’s were not able (due to lack of knowledge or expertise) to make decisions that would need to be made.  They would, of necessity, have to rely upon technocrats and other specialists from the various sub-committees at Church Headquarters.  President McKay’s concern was that this movement would involve an ecclesiastical abdication of the God-given authority to led the Church.</p>
<p>This model of Prophetic leadership in temporal, as well as spiritual matters, has a long and varied history in the standard works and has been exemplified by our earliest and most influential leaders.  The first reason therefore that I am unconvinced that there is an alternative to a mixture (even a heavy emphasis) on the bureaucratic, as opposed to the prophetic, in our Church leadership is that theologically they are expected to be able to guide a temporally-situated Church.  Yet, their burden is fraught with a multiplicity of complex challenges that Joseph Smith, Brigham Young and others never faced.</p>
<p>John Dehlin rightly notes that within this they have a responsibility to protect the image of the ‘Prophetic Mantle’.  In one sense, therefore, it seems possible that although they believe that as &#8216;Prophets, Seers and Revelators&#8217; they have a responsibility over the temporal, they also feel a sense of dissatisfaction or dissonance over the types of decisions they have to make.  This is evident by the fact they do not talk about such decisions and even try to mask these processes from the general membership because they feel that such decision-making processes might undermine the image of the ‘Prophetic Mantle’.  I think they are right; it might well have this effect.</p>
<p>Now it is possible to argue that the &#8216;Prophetic Mantle&#8217; does not need to be protected.  I can sympathise with this position however I believe that the Brethren intentionally present a view of their work which most accurately exemplifies what they expect from their local leaders.  Bishops and Stake Presidents do not make the same type of decisions that might require this legalistic-bureaucractic framework and they therefore expect local leaders to seek the Spirit in dealing with spiritual matters.  I am not convinced that this is disingenuous  but rather sense that they are trying to model the gospel in action to a culturally and intellectually diverse membership.</p>
<p>Therefore, they are in a tough, ecclesiastical bind.  Abdicate the responsibility for the kingdom (to a small or even a large extent) or face the possibility of undermining the ‘Prophetic Mantle’, which I believe they have, and giving scope for local leaders to approach issues in this same legalistic-bureaucractic manner.</p>
<p>I can see why they do what they do because I am not sure I see a valid alternative, theologically or organisationally.  Do you?</p>
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		<title>Interfaith Marriages by guest Madam Curie</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/01/30/interfaith-marriages-by-guest-madam-curie/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/01/30/interfaith-marriages-by-guest-madam-curie/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Jan 2010 06:02:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>guest</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[accountability]]></category>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=9567</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[A recent post by Cr@ig on Main Street Plaza caused me to reflect on the strength of interfaith marriages. I had hoped to generate a follow-up post on this topic at MSP. However, since the comments on the Cr@ig&#8217;s post devolved into a blame game of whether the believer or non-believer was more responsible for marital dissolution, I decided it was probably best to avoid a second opportunity for mud-slinging. Differences in religious belief can be the death knell to a marriage. For that reason, many organized religions strongly advocate against being &#8220;yoked with unbelievers&#8221;. This is not only a Mormon phenomenon; you see this in any faith tradition that teaches that they alone have exclusive access to God. Even before marriage, it is rare for the unmarried, devout Mormon to even consider dating (let alone marrying) a non-Mormon; most LDS women raised in the Church are taught from an early age to make a temple marriage to a returned missionary their primary goal. Likewise, in the Catholic Church, marriage to any non-Catholic (including Protestants!) is not permitted within a Catholic church building, and is not considered to be a Sacrament. In particularly conservative Catholic cultures, it really is considered [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A <a href="http://latterdaymainstreet.com/?p=1366">recent post by Cr@ig on Main Street Plaza</a> caused me to reflect on the strength of interfaith marriages. I had hoped to generate a follow-up post on <a href="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/widget_aNmyKwVTviYyKT3urbhn6J.jpg"><img class="alignright size-full wp-image-9568" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/widget_aNmyKwVTviYyKT3urbhn6J.jpg" alt="" width="232" height="232" /></a>this topic at MSP. However, since the comments on the Cr@ig&#8217;s post devolved into a blame game of whether the believer or non-believer was more responsible for marital dissolution, I decided it was probably best to avoid a second opportunity for mud-slinging.</p>
<p>Differences in religious belief can be the death knell to a marriage. For that reason, many organized religions strongly advocate against being &#8220;yoked with unbelievers&#8221;. This is not only a Mormon phenomenon; you see this in any faith tradition that teaches that they alone have exclusive access to God. Even before marriage, it is rare for the unmarried, devout Mormon to even consider dating (let alone marrying) a non-Mormon; most LDS women raised in the Church are taught from an early age to make a temple marriage to a returned missionary their primary goal.<span id="more-9567"></span></p>
<p>Likewise, in the Catholic Church, marriage to any non-Catholic (including Protestants!) is not permitted within a Catholic church building, and is not considered to be a Sacrament. In particularly conservative Catholic cultures, it really is considered a heresy to marry someone not of the (same rite of the) Catholic Church. Consider, for example, the movie My Big Fat Greek Wedding: Toula refuses to marry Protestant Ian until he joins the Greek Orthodox Church (thus leading to a humorous scene of Ian being baptized).</p>
<p>Similar to Mormon &#8216;Marriage Prep&#8217; and &#8216;Temple Prep&#8217; Sunday School courses, dating Catholic couples are required to pursue a several-month course of marriage preparations classes, known as Pre-Cana. Similar to Mormons, Catholics who have pre-marital sexual relations (usually known from the resulting offspring) cannot be married on Catholic church grounds. However, they can have their marriage &#8220;convalidated&#8221; at a later date, similar to to a family being &#8216;sealed&#8217; a year after a civil marriage.</p>
<p>I compare these things not so much to indicate how Catholics do things so much as to show just how non-unique Mormons are in many ways with regards to their approach to interfaith marriage.</p>
<p>Disbelief that comes after marriage, however, is harder to deal with. Despite the admonition of Paul in the 1 Corinthians that:</p>
<blockquote><p>[I]f any brother has a wife who is an unbeliever, and she consents to live with him, he should not divorce her. If any woman has a husband who is an unbeliever, and he consents to live with her, she should not divorce him. For the unbelieving husband is consecrated through his wife, and the unbelieving wife is consecrated through her husband. Otherwise, your children would be unclean, but as it is they are holy. (1 Cor. 7:12-14)</p></blockquote>
<p>it is really not all that uncommon to see marriages Mormon temple marriages dissolve once one member of the union loses faith. The same can also be true in Catholic culture, where one of the vows made at the altar is to raise your children Catholic.</p>
<p>A few examples, then, to illustrate some of what I am talking about:</p>
<p>A Mormon female friend of mine (who also happens to be a reader of this blog) attended a non-LDS university for college. Her Patriarchal Blessing was explicit that she was to marry an RM in the temple. When a Baptist schoolmate asked her on a date, she turned him down several times before giving him an ultimatum: She would only go on a date with him if he would read the Book of Mormon and consent to taking the missionary discussions. Confident that the Mormon church was misguided, and that he could show her the error of her ways, he consented. He joined the LDS Church and they two were married in the temple a year later. Obviously, she and the Church would consider this example to be a huge success story; his Baptist family, in contrast, at that time considered their daughter-in-law to be the devil incarnate. (I suspect that they mellowed with time).</p>
<p>Another friend at the same university for four years dated a non-Mormon off and on, and was fairly involved with him physically (although never so far that she needed to go to the Bishop). She loved him and he proposed to her, but since he was not interested in the Church, she said no. Several years later, she met and married a convert of 1 year, in the temple. Another Church success story.</p>
<p>A Jewish friend attended a Jew-friendly university, but did not find a spouse. She later moved to an area in the Midwest that was predominantly Protestant, and met and fell in love with a Protestant. They moved in together, but when her family would call or visit, she threw him out of the house for the weekend. When her parents found out that she was dating this man, they first gave her a series of lectures on being &#8216;married under the canopy&#8217; and of all that her grandmother had suffered at Auschwitz. They then cut off all verbal communication with her. When the grandmother found out about the boyfriend, she literally suffered a stroke. She broke up with the boyfriend, and later married an Orthodox Jew and was welcomed back into her family.</p>
<p>A Muslim co-worker of my husband&#8217;s met and married a Hindi woman. The parents of the Muslim refuse to acknowledge their daughter-in-law, and the parents of the Hindu refuse to call the Muslim by his real name, instead calling him by the Hindi equivalent.</p>
<p>When I married my husband, we were both Mormon, however I had converted to the Church as a young adult. My mother&#8217;s side of the family (who are culturally Catholic) refused to speak with my husband at family functions and boycotted our wedding. Indeed, my own marriage might now be considered as an interfaith marriage, with each of us losing our faith in the LDS Church and taking divergent faith paths. I&#8217;ve left the LDS Church and now consider myself a post-Mormon liberal Catholic, returning to the faith of my mothers (since Catholicism in America is largely passed down matriarchally). My husband is an agnostic atheist who remains actively Mormon: regularly attending his meetings and &#8216;magnifying&#8217; his calling, held in the church by the faith of his fathers. My family is urging me to do what my responsibility as a Catholic mother would be: to baptize my son Catholic and raise him in the Catholic Church.</p>
<p>And so it goes, and so it goes. Its remarkable how adherents of all faiths claim that God will only recognize marriage in their church.</p>
<p>Through it all, my husband and I have retained enormous respect for each other and our religious decisions, as well as the effect that those decisions have on our son. I think respect for each other is really the only way such marriages can survive. My husband&#8217;s loss of belief was founded in his respect for me: Trusting that my reasoning was sound, he wanted to determine for himself what validity there was in my conclusions. Obviously, we came to different end-points, but part of respect is learning to accept (and even welcome) differences of opinion and conclusion.</p>
<p>My questions for the readership are these:</p>
<ul>
<li>What are your stories?</li>
<li>How can a couple who finds themselves in a Mormon interfaith marriage make the relationship work?</li>
<li> Is it possible to maintain a believing Mormon/non-believer relationship?</li>
<li>If so, what components are required?</li>
</ul>
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		<slash:comments>28</slash:comments>
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		<title>For God&#8217;s Sake, Blog!</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/01/24/for-gods-sake-blog/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/01/24/for-gods-sake-blog/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sun, 24 Jan 2010 19:00:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Mormon Heretic</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[apologetics]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[apostles]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[catholicism]]></category>
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		<category><![CDATA[President Monson]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=9489</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I wish I could claim credit for the title of the post, but it actually comes from this MSNBC article.  Apparently the Pope is encouraging Catholic Priests to blog.  It reminded me of Elder Ballard&#8217;s admonition back in 2007.  Even though the pope doesn&#8217;t love computers, he said, &#8220;Priests are thus challenged to proclaim the Gospel by employing the latest generation of audiovisual resources — images, videos, animated features, blogs, Web sites — which, alongside traditional means, can open up broad new vistas for dialogue, evangelization and catechesis,&#8221; he said. Apparently, the Pope is even on Facebook.  So, I had to check and see if Pres Monson is there too.  Well, there are some pages on him, but I don&#8217;t think he&#8217;s officially there.  Perhaps he is, but his 234 fans are quite a bit behind the Pope&#8217;s 87,429. So, it looks like the Catholic  Church is ahead of the Mormons on Facebook, but the blog advice is more than 2 years behind us.  The Newsroom at LDS.org has Elder Ballard&#8217;s talk from Dec 15, 2007 Most of you already know that if you have access to the Internet you can start a blog in minutes and begin sharing what [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wish I could claim credit for the title of the post, but it actually comes from <a href="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/35029694/ns/world_news-world_faith/">this MSNBC article</a>.  Apparently the Pope is encouraging Catholic Priests to blog.  It reminded me of Elder Ballard&#8217;s admonition back in 2007.  Even though the pope doesn&#8217;t love computers, he said, <span id="more-9489"></span></p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;Priests are thus challenged to proclaim the Gospel by employing the latest generation of audiovisual resources — images, videos, animated features, blogs, Web sites — which, alongside traditional means, can open up broad new vistas for dialogue, evangelization and catechesis,&#8221; he said.</p></blockquote>
<p>Apparently, <a href="http://www.facebook.com/search/?q=pope+benedict&amp;init=quick">the Pope is even on Facebook</a>.  So, I had to check and see if Pres Monson is there too.  Well, there are some <a href="http://www.facebook.com/search/?q=thomas+monson&amp;init=quick">pages on him</a>, but I don&#8217;t think he&#8217;s officially there.  Perhaps he is, but his 234 fans are quite a bit behind the Pope&#8217;s 87,429.</p>
<p>So, it looks like the Catholic  Church is ahead of the Mormons on Facebook, but the blog advice is more than 2 years behind us.  The <a href="http://www.newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/news-releases-stories/using-new-media-to-support-the-work-of-the-church">Newsroom at LDS.org</a> has Elder Ballard&#8217;s talk from Dec 15, 2007</p>
<blockquote><p>Most of you already know that if you have access to the Internet you can start a blog in minutes and begin sharing what you know to be true.  You can download videos from Church and other appropriate sites, including Newsroom at LDS.org, and send them to your friends.  You can write to media sites on the Internet that report on the Church, and voice your views as to the accuracy of the reports.</p></blockquote>
<p>Did you ever think you&#8217;d hear these octogenarians telling us to embrace Facebook and Blogs???  How much of an impact do you think blogs are having on them?</p>
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		<slash:comments>22</slash:comments>
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		<title>On Being an Apostle but not in the Quorum</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/01/11/on-being-an-apostle-but-not-in-the-quorum/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/01/11/on-being-an-apostle-but-not-in-the-quorum/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jan 2010 06:45:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Aaron R. aka Rico</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[apostles]]></category>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=8939</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[‘In 1866, at the age of only twenty-seven, Joseph F. Smith was ordained an Apostle by President Brigham Young, and served briefly as one of his special additional counselors. When a vacancy occurred in the Twelve the following year, Elder Smith was sustained as a member of that quorum’ [1].  The date was Oct 8, 1867.  This means Joseph F. Smith was an Apostle a year before he joined the Quorum of the twelve.  Moreover, BY ordained Joseph F. Smith spontaneously without consultation of all members of the First presidency [2].  Lest we think this is just another aberration of the Brigham Young period, it has occurred a few times in the Church’s history.  What does this tell us about what it means to be an Apostle, and what is the relationship between the quorum and the office? As a lead into the rest of this discussion the other people who had this experience are: Joseph Angell Young – One of Brigham Young’s sons was ordained in 1864 and was never subsequent invited into the quorum [3]. ‘Brigham Young, Jr., was ordained as an Apostle by his father on February 4, 1864, but he did not become a member of the [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>‘In 1866, at the age of only twenty-seven, Joseph F. Smith was ordained an Apostle by President Brigham Young, and served briefly as <img class="alignright" title="joseph f. smith" src="http://www.lightplanet.com/mormons/images/leaders/jfs_1.jpg" alt="" width="234" height="300" />one of his special additional counselors. When a vacancy occurred in the Twelve the following year, Elder Smith was sustained as a member of that quorum’ [1].  The date was Oct 8, 1867.  This means Joseph F. Smith was an Apostle a year before he joined the Quorum of the twelve.  Moreover, BY ordained Joseph F. Smith spontaneously without consultation of all members of the First presidency [2].  Lest we think this is just another aberration of the Brigham Young period, it has occurred a few times in the Church’s history.  What does this tell us about what it means to be an Apostle, and what is the relationship between the quorum and the office?<span id="more-8939"></span></p>
<p>As a lead into the rest of this discussion the other people who had this experience are:</p>
<p>Joseph Angell Young – One of Brigham Young’s sons was ordained in 1864 and was never subsequent invited into the quorum [3].</p>
<p>‘Brigham Young, Jr., was ordained as an Apostle by his father on February 4, 1864, but he did not become a member of the Council of the Twelve until October 1868, when he was chosen to fill the vacancy caused by George A. Smith’ [4].</p>
<p>Sylvester Q. Cannon was ordained an Apostle on April 14<sup>th</sup>, 1938 and was set-apart in the Quorum April 6<sup>th</sup> 1939, a year later [3].</p>
<p>Finally Alvin R. Dyer was called as an Apostle on October 5<sup>th</sup> 1967 but was never included in the Quorum, and was actually incorporated into the First Quorum of Seventy when it was created in Oct 1<sup>st</sup> 1976 [3].</p>
<p>The last person that might have been in a similar situation was David Whitmer &amp; Oliver Cowdrey (D&amp;C 18: 9), but I will not discuss this here [5].</p>
<p>President McKay once said: &#8220;There are apostles who are not members of the council. I think there were in that day [i.e., in New Testament times], at least they were considered to be apostles… A man may be an apostle but not one of the Council of the Twelve&#8221; [4].  That people can be ordained as an Apostle without being a member of the Twelve suggests that it is a Priesthood office which could be bestowed on those who are prepared.</p>
<p>In an article by David L. Paulsen, Joseph Smith is recorded to have said in a meeting in 1833, after a vision of the Father and the Son, &#8220;Brethren, now you are prepared to be the apostles of Jesus Christ, for you have seen both the Father and the Son and know that They exist and that They are two separate personages&#8221; [6].  President McKay, in the citation above, uses the example of Paul and Barabbas who were considered Apostles without them being included in the Quorum.  Paul it seems may have been later, while for Barabbas it is less clear.  It seems they were considered to be Apostles on the basis of what they had seen and that they were felt called to the ministry.</p>
<p>This seems to imply something similar to what Ammon describes in the Book of Mormon.  He says ‘I am called by that Holy Spirit to teach [the gospel]… and a portion of that Spirit dwelleth in me, which giveth me knowledge and also power’ (Alma 18: 34-5).  Moreover, there is a distinction between the calling and the ordinance associated with Priesthood power (see Al 13: 8).  In addition D&amp;C 121: 37 argues that the powers of heaven may be conferred upon us, but that there are inseparable from the Spirit.  In fact if this section of scripture teaches us anything then it is that the Holy Ghost, through a Saintly life, gives power to an individual (see D&amp;C 121: 46) not by the virtue of the Priesthood (D&amp;C 121:40).</p>
<p>This suggest two things to me: first being an Apostle is not necessarily about being in the Quorum of the Twelve and that it may well be a Priesthood office, like High Priest, rather than a calling in that Priesthood.  Second there is a conception that Mormonism has scope for the ‘Priesthood of all believers’ type view.  Meaning that spiritual power is given to those who are called by God or receive that power, rather than by merely being ordained.</p>
<p>Notes:</p>
<p>1. Richard O. Cowan, <em>The Church in the Twentieth Century </em>[Salt Lake City: Bookcraft, 1985], 45.</p>
<p>2. Truman G. Madsen; see also Scott Kenney, <em>Joseph F. Smith</em> in The Presidents of the Church, ed. L.J. Arrington [Salt Lake City, UT.: Deseret Book, ?] p. 191.</p>
<p>3. Encyclopaedia of Mormonism, Appendix 1, p. 1631-51.</p>
<p>4. David O. McKay, <em>Gospel Ideals: Selections from the Discourses of David O. McKay</em> [Salt Lake City: Improvement Era, 1953], 250.</p>
<p>5. See Brigham Young, <em>Journal of Discourses</em> <strong>6</strong>:320 and Heber C. Kimball, <em>Journal of Discourses</em> <strong>6</strong>:29.</p>
<p>6. David L. Paulsen, <em>The Doctrine of Divine Embodiment: Restoration, Judeo-Christian, and Philosophical Perspectives</em> in BYU Studies, vol. 35, no. 4 (Provo UT.: BYU Press, 1996).</p>
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		<title>Think for yourself or not – that is the question .Cognitive Dissonance 1</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/01/09/think-for-yourself-or-not-%e2%80%93-that-is-the-question-cognitive-dissonance-1/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2010/01/09/think-for-yourself-or-not-%e2%80%93-that-is-the-question-cognitive-dissonance-1/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Jan 2010 06:01:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>James</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[accountability]]></category>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=8888</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Many of you in the bloggernacle thrive on having two opposing ideas at once in your head. I have always found that difficult. I have seen many who can’t cope with it at all and have to come to a conclusion one way or the other or their belief system will cave in and their minds will explode. I have all the best intentions in the world to start a series on cognitive dissonance this year. To start off I have found some quotes from the brethren which seems to be in opposition to each other. I am sure some of you will figure out away in which they are not! Don’t Think for Yourself!! &#8220;Any Latter-day Saint who denounces or opposes whether actively or otherwise, any plan or doctrine advocated by the prophets, seers, revelators&#8217; of the church, is cultivating the spirit of apostasy. One cannot speak evil of the lord&#8217;s annointed&#8230; and retain the holy spirit in his heart. This sort of game is Satan&#8217;s favorite pastime, and he has practiced it to believing souls since Adam. He {Satan} wins a great victory when he can get members of the church to speak against their leaders and to [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/Dont-think-for-your-self1.jpg"><img class="size-full wp-image-8889 alignnone" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/Dont-think-for-your-self1.jpg" alt="" width="455" height="138" /></a></p>
<p><a href="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/Think-for-yourself1.jpg"><img class="size-full wp-image-8890 alignnone" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/Think-for-yourself1.jpg" alt="" width="276" height="120" /></a></p>
<p><img src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-includes/js/tinymce/plugins/wordpress/img/trans.gif" alt="" /></p>
<p><span id="more-8888"></span></p>
<p style="text-align: justify"><strong>Many of you in the bloggernacle thrive on having two opposing ideas at once in your head. I have always found that difficult.  I have seen many who can’t cope with it at all and have to come to a conclusion one way or the other or their belief system will cave in and their minds will explode.</strong></p>
<p style="text-align: justify"><strong>I have all the best intentions in the world to start a series on cognitive dissonance this year.  To start off I have found some quotes from the brethren which seems to be in opposition to each other. I am sure some of you will figure out away in which they are not!</strong></p>
<p><span style="color: #800000"><strong>Don’t Think for Yourself!!</strong></span></p>
<p style="text-align: justify">&#8220;Any Latter-day Saint who denounces or opposes whether actively or otherwise, any plan or doctrine advocated by the prophets, seers, revelators&#8217; of the church, is cultivating the spirit of apostasy. One cannot speak evil of the lord&#8217;s annointed&#8230; and retain the holy spirit in his heart. This sort of game is Satan&#8217;s favorite pastime, and he has practiced it to believing souls since Adam. He {Satan} wins a great victory when he can get members of the church to speak against their leaders and to do their own thinking.&#8221;</p>
<p style="text-align: justify">&#8220;When our leaders speak, the thinking has been done. When they propose a plan&#8211;it is God&#8217;s Plan. When they point the way, there is no other which is safe. When they give directions, it should mark the end of controversy, God works in no other way. To think otherwise, without immediate repentance, may cost one his faith, may destroy his testimony, and leave him a stranger to the kingdom of God.&#8221;</p>
<p>Ward Teachers Message, Deseret News, Church Section p. 5, May 26, 1945<br />
Also included in the <em>Improvement Era</em>, June 1945 (which was the official church magazine before the <em>Ensign</em>)</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;</p>
<p style="text-align: justify">&#8220;Always keep your eye on the President of the church, and if he ever tells you to do anything, even if it is wrong, and you do it, the lord will bless you for it but you don&#8217;t need to worry. The lord will never let his mouthpiece lead the people astray.&#8221;</p>
<p style="text-align: justify">LDS President Marion G. Romney (of the first presidency), quoting LDS President (and prophet) Heber J. Grant &#8220;Conference Report&#8221; Oct. 1960 p. 78</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;</p>
<p style="text-align: justify">&#8220;The Lord Almighty leads this Church, and he will never suffer you to be led astray if you are found doing your duty. You may go home and sleep as sweetly as a babe in its mother&#8217;s arms, as to any danger of your leaders leading you astray, for if they should try to do so the Lord would quickly sweep them from the earth.&#8221;</p>
<p>Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 9, p. 289, 1862.</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;</p>
<p>&#8220;When the Prophet speaks the debate is over&#8221;.</p>
<p>N. Eldon Tanner, August <em>Ensign</em> 1979, pages 2-3</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;</p>
<p style="text-align: justify">&#8220;I sat in this tabernacle some years ago as President Joseph Fielding Smith stood at this pulpit. It was the general priesthood meeting of April 1972, the last general conference before President Smith passed away. He said: &#8216;There is one thing which we should have exceedingly clear in our minds. Neither the President of the Church, nor the First Presidency, or the united voice of the First Presidency and the Twelve will ever lead the Saints astray or send forth counsel to the world that is contrary to the mind and will of the lord&#8217;.&#8221;</p>
<p>L. Aldin Porter of the Presidency of the First Quorum of Seventies (<em>Ensign</em>, Nov. 1994, p. 63)</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;</p>
<p>&#8220;Follow your leaders who have been duly ordained and have been publicly sustained, and you will not be led astray.&#8221;</p>
<p>Boyd K. Packer (General Conference, Oct. 1992; <em>Ensign</em>, Nov. 1992)</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;-</p>
<p>&#8220;The Lord will never permit me or any other man who stands as President of this Church to lead you astray.&#8221;</p>
<p>President Wilford Woodruff (considered scripture as it is canonized at the end of the D&amp;C)</p>
<p><span style="color: #800000"><strong>Think for Yourself!!</strong></span></p>
<p style="text-align: justify">President Joseph F. Smith said, &#8220;We talk of obedience, but do we require any man or woman to ignorantly obey the counsels that are given? Do the First Presidency require it? No, never.&#8221; (<em>Journal of Discources</em> (JD) 16:248)</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;</p>
<p style="text-align: justify">Apostle Charles W. Penrose, who would later serve as counselor to President Smith, declared: &#8220;President Wilford Woodruff is a man of wisdom and experience, and we respect him, but we do not believe his personal views or utterances are revelations from God; and when &#8216;Thus saith the Lord&#8217;, comes from him, the saints investigate it: they do not shut their eyes and take it down like a pill.&#8221; (<em>Millennial Star</em> 54:191)</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;</p>
<p style="text-align: justify">&#8220;And none are required to tamely and blindly submit to a man because he has a portion of the priesthood. We have heard men who hold the priesthood remark, that they would do anything they were told to do by those who presided over them, if they knew it was wrong; but such obedience as this is worse than folly to us; it is slavery in the extreme; and the man who would thus willingly degrade himself should not claim a rank among intelligent beings, until he turns from his folly. A man of God&#8230; would despise the idea. Others, in the extreme exercise of their almighty authority have taught that such obedience was necessary, and that no matter what the saints were told to do by their presidents, they should do it without asking any questions. When Elders of Israel will so far indulge in these extreme notions of obedience as to teach them to the people, it is generally because they have it in their minds to do wrong themselves.&#8221; (<em>Millennial Star</em>, vol.14 #38, pp. 593-95)</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;</p>
<p>Brigham Young said:</p>
<p style="text-align: justify">&#8220;What a pity it would be, if we were led by one man to utter destruction! Are you afraid of this? I am more afraid that this people have so much confidence in their leaders that they will not inquire for themselves of God whether they are led by him. I am fearful they settle down in a state of blind self-security, trusting their eternal destiny in the hands of their leaders with a reckless confidence that in itself would thwart the purposes of God in their salvation, and weaken the influence they could give to their leaders, did they know for themselves, by the revelations of Jesus, that they are led in the right way. Let every man and woman know, themselves, whether their leaders are walking in the path the Lord dictates, or not. This has been my exhortation continually.&#8221; (JD 9:150)</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;</p>
<p style="text-align: justify">&#8220;How easy it would be for your leaders to lead you to destruction, unless you actually know the mind and will of the spirit yourselves.&#8221; (JD 4:368)</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;-</p>
<p style="text-align: justify">&#8220;I do not wish any Latter-day Saint in this world, nor in heaven, to be satisfied with anything I do, unless the Spirit of the Lord Jesus Christ, the spirit of revelation, makes them satisfied&#8230;Suppose that the people were heedless, that they manifested no concern with regard to the things of the kingdom of God, but threw the whole burden upon the leaders of the people, saying, &#8216;If the brethren who take charge of matters are satisfied, we are,&#8217; this is not pleasing in the sight of the Lord.&#8221; (JD 3:45)</p>
<p style="text-align: justify">&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;-</p>
<p style="text-align: justify">&#8220;&#8230;Now those men, or those women, who know no more about the power of God, and the influences of the Holy Spirit, than to be led entirely by another person, suspending their own understanding, and pinning their faith upon another&#8217;s sleeve, will never be capable of entering into the celestial glory, to be crowned as they anticipate; they will never be capable of becoming Gods. They cannot rule themselves, to say nothing of ruling others, but they must be dictated to in every trifle, like a child. They cannot control themselves in the least, but James, Peter, or somebody else must control them. They never can become Gods, nor be crowned as rulers with glory, immortality, and eternal lives. They never can hold sceptres of glory, majesty, and power in the celestial kingdom. Who will? Those who are valiant and inspired with the true independence of heaven, who will go forth boldly in the service of their God, leaving others to do as they please, determined to do right, though all mankind besides should take the opposite course. Will this apply to any of you? Your own hearts can answer.&#8221; (JD 1:312)</p>
<p style="text-align: justify">&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;</p>
<p style="text-align: justify">&#8220;President Joseph Smith read the 14th chapter of Ezekiel [see, for example, verses 9-10: 'If the prophet be deceived when he hath spoken a thing...the punishment of the prophet shall be even as the punishment of him that seeketh unto him.']&#8230;said the Lord had declared by the Prophet [Ezekiel], that the people should each one stand for himself, and depend on no man or men in that state of corruption of the Jewish church &#8212; that righteous persons could only deliver their own souls &#8212; applied it to the present state [1842] of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints &#8212; said if the people departed from the Lord, they must fall &#8212; that they were depending on the Prophet, hence were darkened in their minds, in consequence of neglecting the duties devolving upon themselves&#8230;&#8221; (<em>Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith</em> pp. 237-38)</p>
<p style="text-align: justify">&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;-</p>
<p style="text-align: justify">George Q. Cannon, Counselor to three Church Presidents, expressed it thus: &#8220;Do not, brethren, put your trust in man though he be a bishop, an apostle, or a president. If you do, they will fail you at some time or place; they will do wrong or seem to, and your support be gone;&#8221; (<em>Millennial Star</em> 53:658-59, quoted in <em>Gospel Truth</em>, 1:319)</p>
<p style="text-align: justify">
<p style="text-align: justify"><strong>Have you had experiences where you think you have genuinely had bad advice from following your leaders?</strong></p>
<p style="text-align: justify"><strong>Later prophets and apostles trump older ones. How do you think the older ones feel about that?<br />
</strong></p>
<p style="text-align: justify"><strong>Have you had times where you had so much on your plate you were glad to let someone think for you and it worked out for the best?<br />
</strong></p>
<p><strong>Should we think for ourselves in the church or should we let the Brethren think for us that is the question?<br />
</strong></p>
<p><strong><br />
</strong></p>
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		<title>The Word of Wisdom and the Temple: Personal, Political and Prophetic Dimensions</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2009/12/28/the-word-of-wisdom-and-the-temple-personal-political-and-prophetic-dimensions/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2009/12/28/the-word-of-wisdom-and-the-temple-personal-political-and-prophetic-dimensions/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Dec 2009 06:45:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Aaron R. aka Rico</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[apostles]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Culture]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[doctrine]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[General Authorities]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[LDS]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Leaders]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Mormon]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[prophets]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[revelation]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[theology]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Word of Wisdom]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[church]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[truth]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=8695</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Obedience to the Word of Wisdom, it is commonly known, was not always a requirement for entering the Temple or advancement in the Priesthood.  What is less clear from the historicl record is when this principle moved to become a requirement.  President Joseph Fielding Smith believed the change occurred in 1851, but an excellent article by McCue has shown this cannot be the case [1].  Others have argued that it occurred under the Joseph F. Smith administration (he seems to have been the first to have said it was a commandment &#8211; but it was only made a test of fellowship in extreme cases and informally in a letter dated Dec 28 1915 [2]).  Contrastingly Thomas Alexander argued that it happened under President Grant.  I agree with Alexander, but there is even confusion about when it was made official, was it early 20&#8242;s or early 30&#8242;s and what led to these changes? According to Allen and Leonard ‘perhaps no doctrine was preached more enthusiastically by President Grant or stressed more in Church literature during his administration than the Word of Wisdom’ [3].  Arrington’s seminal (if not a little controversial essay) on the economic factors that led to the importance of the Word of Wisdom [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Obedience to the Word of Wisdom, it is commonly known, was not always a requirement for entering the Temple or <img class="alignright" src="http://wendyusuallywanders.files.wordpress.com/2008/06/heber_j_grant.jpg" alt="" width="156" height="197" />advancement in the Priesthood.  What is less clear from the historicl record is when this principle moved to become a requirement.  President Joseph Fielding Smith believed the change occurred in 1851, but an excellent article by McCue has shown this cannot be the case [1].  Others have argued that it occurred under the Joseph F. Smith administration (he seems to have been the first to have said it was a commandment &#8211; but it was only made a test of fellowship in extreme cases and informally in a letter dated Dec 28 1915 [2]).  Contrastingly Thomas Alexander argued that it happened under President Grant.  I agree with Alexander, but there is even confusion about when it was made official, was it early 20&#8242;s or early 30&#8242;s and what led to these changes?</p>
<p><span id="more-8695"></span></p>
<p>According to Allen and Leonard ‘perhaps no doctrine was preached more enthusiastically by President Grant or stressed more in Church literature during his administration than the Word of Wisdom’ [3].  Arrington’s seminal (if not a little controversial <a href="http://www.signaturebookslibrary.org/byu/chapter2.htm">essay</a>) on the economic factors that led to the importance of the Word of Wisdom deals with the period till 1900 and misses some crucial occurrences in the lead up to this principle becoming a ‘commandment’.</p>
<p><strong>The Personal</strong></p>
<p>President Grant had a friend who had died young because of alcohol related problems (according to Truman Madsen it was cirrhosis of the liver [4]).  At the funeral President Grant records, in a sermon given in 1931, that ‘as I stood at his grave I looked up to heaven and made a pledge to my God that liquor and tobacco would have in me an enemy who would fight with all the ability that God would give me to the day of my death, and I have kept that pledge so far’[5].  Perhaps what haunted President Grant most was that this young man had given up his habits to serve a mission, but had quickly resumed them when he finished his service.</p>
<p><strong>The Political</strong></p>
<p>According to the Encyclopaedia of Mormonism ‘The [prohibition] movement intensified the Church&#8217;s interest in the Word of Wisdom. There is evidence that Church Presidents John Taylor, Joseph F. Smith, and Heber J. Grant wanted to promote adherence to the Word of Wisdom as a precondition for entering LDS temples or holding office in any Church organization; and indeed, by 1930 abstinence from the use of alcohol, tobacco, coffee, and tea had become an official requirement for those seeking temple recommends.’[6].   </p>
<p>It seems this interest became even more pronounced when the calls for repeal began.  President Grant’s concern can be seen in his April 2, 1932 General Conference address.  There was a controversial speech by Elder Stephen L. Richards at that same conference which will be discussed later.  But at the very least, it seems that President Grant’s emphasis on making the Word of Wisdom a requirement emerged out of a political context in which he saw liquor becoming a problem for the Latter-day Saints.  He had lived through and been an Apostle through some of the previous period of emphasis which Arrington documents, and perhaps did not want to see the Church membership go down that road again.</p>
<p>Perhaps President Grant saw the Church collectively as being like his friend.  He may thought the membership would enter a period of relapse; and he was trying to prevent it.</p>
<p><strong>The Prophetic</strong></p>
<p>What is surprising, is that in President Grant’s sermons on this issue and on the policy change he does not cite any direct revelation.  Interestingly, President Grant said in 1928, which seems to contradict Alexander&#8217;s thesis of the 1921 date, that &#8216;the Lord has not made this an absolute commandment&#8217;.  The implication here from President Grant however, is that if the Lord asks his people to do something then we should respond.  In addition, in a CHI (published in 1928) the Word of Wisdom was not explicitly mentioned as a requirement for the Temple, but was in the 1933 edition [2].  Thus although the issue seems to have been informally incorporated as policy its codification was not enforced until the early 1930&#8242;s in-line with the possible repeal of Prohibition. </p>
<p>In addition, the evidence suggests that there has never been a sustaining vote on this issue [1].  I am not claiming that President Grant never believed he had received revelation on this issue nor that he never shared a testimony that he believed this principle was revelation.  What interests me is how, as a Prophet, he did not justify this change by referring to a revelatory experience but rather in a personal commitment to a principle and to political or social fears.  I would have expected an effort, like President Kimball discusses, of overcoming bias and prejudice that individuals hold in order to prepare for revelation.  For President Grant it seems that he moved forward in a different way.</p>
<p><strong>Some Controversy</strong></p>
<p>Stephen L. Richards who was an Apostle during this time gave a sermon, which was apparently not printed in the conference report <img class="alignright" src="http://www.ldsces.org/inst_manuals/chft/images/a12-51.gif" alt="" width="182" height="241" />because it angered President Grant.  It has been subsequently printed by <a href="https://www.sunstonemagazine.com/pdf/015-43-46.pdf">Sunstone</a>.  The sermon suggested that there was fanaticism in the way Church leaders had approached the issue of the Word of Wisdom, and other behaviours.  The date Sunstone give for the delivery of this sermon is the 9<sup>th</sup> April 1932.  Although there was not a General Conference session on that day, Stan Larson (<a href="http://www.signaturebooks.com/excerpts/truth.htm">source</a> &#8211; fn 79) in a footnote in his work on B.H. Roberts makes reference to a Salt Lake Tribune article and First Presidency meeting that discussed Richards’ talk on the 9<sup>th</sup> and the day after.  Sunstone claim they got their transcript from the Church archives.  So there is some confusion in my mind at least about where this comes from.  However, according to Michael Quinn [7], on May 5<sup>th</sup> 1932, Stephen L. Richards told the First Presidency and Quorum of the Twelve that he will resign as apostle rather than apologize for his general conference talk which argued that the Church is putting too much emphasis on the Word of Wisdom. However on the 26<sup>th</sup> May he later recanted and apologised for his <a href="http://www.i4m.com/think/history/mormon_history.htm">remarks</a>.  What this suggests to me is that this move may have been as much a personal drive from President Grant as from a revelation.  Moreover, it certainly was not wholly accepted at face value by all of the twelve.</p>
<p>Notes</p>
<p>1. Robert J. McCue, <em>Did the Word of Wisdom become a Commandment in 1851?</em> in Dialogue, no. 3 [Salt Lake City, UT.: Dialogue Foundation, 1981], p. 66-77.</p>
<p>2. Thomas G. Alexander, <em>The Word of Wisdom: From Principle to Requirement </em>in Dialogue, no. 3 [Salt Lake City, UT.: Dialogue Foundation, 1981], pp. 79</p>
<p>3. James B. Allen and Glen M. Leonard, <em>The Story of the Latter-day Saints,</em> 2nd ed., rev. and enl. [Salt Lake City: Deseret Book Co., 1992], 525 &#8211; 526.</p>
<p>4. Truman G. Madsen, <em>The Presidents of the Church</em>, [Salt Lake City, UT. Deseret Book, 2004).</p>
<p>5. President Heber J. Grant, <em>Answering Tobacco&#8217;s Challenge</em> in Improvement Era, 1931, (Vol. Xxxiv. June, 1931. No. 8.)</p>
<p>6. Joseph Lyons, <em>Encyclopedia of Mormonism, </em>1-4 vols., edited by Daniel H. Ludlow (New York: Macmillan, 1992), 1584.</p>
<p>7. D. Michael Quinn, <em>The Mormon Hierarchy: Extensions of Power</em> [Salt Lake City, UT.: Signature Books, 1997).</p>
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		<slash:comments>22</slash:comments>
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		<title>In the Shadow of the Temple by Guest</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2009/12/22/in-the-shadow-of-the-temple-by-guest/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2009/12/22/in-the-shadow-of-the-temple-by-guest/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Dec 2009 14:30:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>guest</dc:creator>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=8674</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[A close friend of mine who wishes to remain anonymous recently saw in the shadow of the temple his story follows In October, I was fortunate to attend the Portland, Oregon, screening of the movie, In the Shadow of the Temple. http://www.intheshadowofthetemple.com The screening was hosted by the producers, Karen Di Millia and Dennis Lavery. Prior to the screening Dennis and Karen spoke for 10 minutes and explained how they started this project. After the screening they took questions and answers for roughly 30 minutes. Lavery and DeMillia, who are not&#8211;and never have been&#8211;LDS, originally planned to make a movie about people who had left the religion of their youth. They attended a meeting of the Portland Humanist Society, explained their project, and asked if anyone had such stories they would be willing to share. In the course of discussing the project with members of the society, they were told that who they really needed to talk to was Sue Emmett, who had left the LDS church. After talking with Sue and others with whom she put them in touch, they decided to re-focus their project on the experience of those who have left the LDS church. They did hundreds [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><img class="alignleft size-medium wp-image-8675" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/Temple-poster-198x300.jpg" alt="Temple poster" width="198" height="300" /></p>
<p>A close friend of mine who wishes to remain anonymous recently saw in the shadow of the temple his story follows</p>
<p>In October, I was fortunate to attend the Portland, Oregon, screening of the movie, In the Shadow of the Temple. <a href="http://www.intheshadowofthetemple.com/">http://www.intheshadowofthetemple.com </a>The screening was hosted by the producers, Karen Di Millia and Dennis Lavery. Prior to the screening Dennis and Karen spoke for 10 minutes and explained how they started this project. After the screening they took questions and answers for roughly 30 minutes.</p>
<p>Lavery and DeMillia, who are not&#8211;and never have been&#8211;LDS, originally planned to make a movie about people who had left the religion of their youth. They attended a meeting of the Portland Humanist Society, explained their project, and asked if anyone had such stories they would be willing to share. In the course of discussing the project with members of the society, they were told that who they really needed to talk to was Sue Emmett, who had left the LDS church. After talking with Sue and others with whom she put them in touch, they decided to re-focus their project on the experience of those who have left the LDS church.<span id="more-8674"></span></p>
<p>They did hundreds of hours of interviews over two years and edited it down to a 55 minute film. The film is very moving&#8211;a tribute to those who shared their stories as well as DeMillia and Lavery&#8217;s videography and editing skills.</p>
<p>About two dozen people appear in interviews in the film. Each story is unique, but a common thread runs throughout them all. All faced a similar rejection by family, friends and community.  Some of those interviewed have left the church. Others no longer believe, but remain active because of family or community pressure. The latter are filmed in shadows, to obscure their identity. The film refers to these people as “Shadow Mormons.” They define &#8220;Shadow Mormons&#8221; as those who privately do not accept the exacting doctrine of the Church, but publicly profess to be true believers. They are in shadow to protect their relationships with family, friends and employers.</p>
<p>Someone commented to me after the film, “That&#8217;s you. You&#8217;re a Shadow Mormon.”</p>
<p>Yes, I&#8217;m a Shadow Mormon. Maybe that&#8217;s why this film hit me so hard. I haven&#8217;t believed in over 20 years – most of my adult life. Yet, during that time I&#8217;ve paid my tithing, gone to the temple, served in bishoprics and high councils and done all the things that were expected of me. Why? Because I am tied to the church by family and community.</p>
<p>The story of &#8220;Grace&#8221; (not her real name) resonated with me because it was so similar to mine. Her pain, and anger, were born of all the energy she has given to a religion that she doesn&#8217;t believe in. Finding out that the Church was not true was like a death experience for her. Like me, she tried following the Church&#8217;s teachings to fast, pray, read the scriptures and yet never felt she received the &#8220;burning in her bosom&#8221; that is promised in the scriptures.</p>
<p>What of the families and communities of these people? What are their stories, their experiences with loved ones who go through a process of losing belief and leaving the church. Only one person who was a family or friend agreed to be interviewed for the film. The believing husband that was interviewed told how he still loved his wife, even though she has left the church. What about the others? Are they embarrassed to say that the Church was more important than their relationship with the person who left?</p>
<p>The saddest stories, to me, were of divorce caused by one spouse believing and the other not believing. Michelle (another woman interviewed in the film) said her heart was broken that her husband would choose the Church over her. He told their marriage therapist that if she had not been Mormon he never would have married her. &#8220;There was more to me than being a Mormon,&#8221; she said.  &#8220;And I thought that there was more to him.&#8221;</p>
<p>The dictionary defines empathy as “the intellectual identification with or vicarious experiencing of the feelings, thoughts, or attitudes of another.” We could all use a little more empathy for those around us. I have had several people tell me, “I can&#8217;t imagine how a person could leave the church.” Either they need a better imagination or they need more empathy.  Maybe they just need to see this film.</p>
<p>One of the questions at the screening&#8211;one that Lavery could not answer&#8211;was, “How do we get the right people to see this film?” Sadly, many members of the church would not even consider it. (It screened in Salt Lake City in October and got almost no media coverage.) The film does not try to de-convert anyone or disparage the doctrine of the church. It doesn&#8217;t assert that someone is right because he or she believes, or that someone else is right because he or she leaves the church. This film is about accepting people regardless of what they believe, and about how we treat those who believe differently than we do. I wish every member of the church could see this film.</p>
<p>Film Trailer: <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICbylWK-i2Q&amp;NR=1">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICbylWK-i2Q&amp;NR=1</a><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICbylWK-i2Q&amp;NR=1"></a></p>
<p><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'; font-style: normal;"><span style="font-size: small;"> </span></span><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'; font-style: normal;"><span style="font-size: small;"> </span></span></p>
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		<title>Temple Wedding Petition</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2009/12/12/temple-wedding-petition/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2009/12/12/temple-wedding-petition/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 06:02:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>James</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[accountability]]></category>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=8492</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[A temple wedding petition to is being circulated to promote love and happiness in the family by changing the church&#8217;s stance on civil marriages preceding temple weddings. The petition requests that the leadership of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints make it acceptable to have a civil marriage ceremony first, if desired, and then giving the couple the necessary time to attend the temple for the sealing ordinance as they do in those countries whose laws require it.  (The petition is not endorsed by Mormon Matters; this information is being shared for discussion as a news item). In the following video which lasts about 2 minutes, Jean talks about the stigma some members may feel if they choose a civil wedding ceremony. The other preseding videos last approximately 2 minutes each. Temple Wedding Petition 3 Here Temple Wedding Petition 1 Here Temple Wedding Petition 2 Here Temple Wedding Petition .org here The actual petition is found here I was raised in a part member family and remember when my brother was married my parents were disappointed that they weren&#8217;t able to go to the temple and see their son get married. It would have been nice for our family [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><img class="alignleft size-medium wp-image-8498" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/Petition-274x300.jpg" alt="Petition" width="274" height="300" />A temple wedding petition to is being circulated to promote love and happiness in the family by changing the church&#8217;s stance on civil marriages preceding temple weddings. The petition requests that the leadership of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints make it acceptable to have a civil marriage ceremony first, if desired, and then giving the couple the necessary time to attend the temple for the sealing ordinance as they do in those countries whose laws require it.  (The petition is not endorsed by Mormon Matters; this information is being shared for discussion as a news item).</p>
<p>In the following video which lasts about 2 minutes, Jean talks about the stigma some members may feel if they choose a civil wedding ceremony. The other preseding videos last approximately 2 minutes each.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PdS1u8LeJU&amp;NR=1">Temple Wedding Petition 3 Here</a></p>
<p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwEpA-lFsX8&amp;NR=1"><span id="more-8492"></span>Temple Wedding Petition 1 Here</a></p>
<p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xf3JPeT69Lg&amp;NR=1">Temple Wedding Petition 2 Here</a></p>
<p><a href="http://www.templeweddingpetition.org/">Temple Wedding Petition .org here</a></p>
<p>The actual petition is found <a href="http://www.templeweddingpetition.org/enter/4952.html">here</a></p>
<p>I was raised in a part member family and remember when my brother was married my parents were disappointed that they weren&#8217;t able to go to the temple and see their son get married. It would have been nice for our family to have seen it. I wonder if it makes non- members, or those on the fringe, feel excluded from the church and may damper future missionary work with families. I live in England and it&#8217;s the law that there is a civil wedding which usually takes place in the chapel.</p>
<p>Recently a nephew was married and was schedueled to get married in the Salt Lake temple. Because much of the family couldn&#8217;t witness the wedding they decided last minute to have a civil wedding. He and his wife since their marriage enjoy going to the temple but have to wait a year now to be married in the temple.</p>
<p>I wonder if there is a church loophol if you want your non- member family to see your wedding you could get married in America and fly to a country where the church allows civil marriages followed by a temple marriage after?</p>
<p>What are your thoughts and experiences?</p>
<p><span style="color: #ff0000"><strong>Just to make it very clear that there is no advocacy on the part of MM</strong></span>.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PdS1u8LeJU&amp;NR=1"></a></p>
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		<title>Brother Brigham Brother Young</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2009/12/06/brother-brigham-brother-young/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2009/12/06/brother-brigham-brother-young/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Dec 2009 06:23:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>James</dc:creator>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=8449</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Recently I drove up Little Cottonwood Canyon with my brother and nephew.  This is the canyon in which many of your ancestors pulled out  the granite for the construction of the salt lake temple. As soon as we passed the granite facings on the side of the canyon my nephew played a song on his iPod by Corb Lund Brother Brigham Brother Young and it brought mental flashes into my mind of men working on the side of the mountain blasting granite out of it.    It made me think of the struggles that men and women had even back then with the faith in many ways very similar to our day. From what I have read Mr Lund isn&#8217;t LDS but has relatives that are. Im assuming one of his relatives is a historian buff? Its probably safe to presume this song will never be played in a chapel but I can&#8217;t help liking it!  You can listen to his song Here Brother Brigham Brother Young music and lyrics by Corb Lund I have sinned so gravely Brother Brigham, Brother Young I have sinned so gravely Brother Young That only you can save me Brother Brigham, Brother Young That only [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong><img class="alignleft size-full wp-image-8451" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/corb-lund1.bmp" alt="corb lund" width="168" height="253" />Recently I drove up Little Cottonwood  Canyon with my brother and nephew.  This is the canyon in which many of your ancestors pulled out  the granite for the construction of the salt lake temple. As soon as we passed the granite facings on the side of the canyon my nephew played a song on his iPod by Corb Lund Brother Brigham Brother Young and it brought mental flashes into my mind of men working on the side of the mountain blasting granite out of it.    It made me think of the struggles that men and women had even back then with the faith in many ways very similar to our day. From what I have read Mr Lund isn&#8217;t LDS but has relatives that are. Im assuming one of his relatives is a historian buff? Its probably safe to presume this song will never be played in a chapel <img src='http://mormonmatters.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  but I can&#8217;t help liking it!  You can listen to his song <a href="http://www.last.fm/music/Corb+Lund/_/Brother+Brigham,+Brother+Young">Here<span id="more-8449"></span></a></strong></p>
<p><strong>Brother Brigham Brother Young</strong></p>
<p>music and lyrics by Corb Lund</p>
<p>I have sinned so gravely Brother Brigham, Brother Young<br />
I have sinned so gravely Brother Young<br />
That only you can save me Brother Brigham, Brother Young<br />
That only you can save me Brother Young</p>
<p>I have revealed the temples secrets Brother Brigham, Brother Young<br />
The temple garments, oaths and secrets Brother Young<br />
I have apostatized and doubted Brother Brigham, Brother Young<br />
And borne my testimony falsely Brother Young</p>
<p>And I have loved a woman Brother Brigham, Brother Young<br />
A woman in adultery Brother Young<br />
I have also wed a negress Brother Brigham, Brother Young<br />
My fifth wife has some color Brigham Young</p>
<p>I now see that you&#8217;re a prophet Brother Brigham, Brother Young<br />
A living, breathing prophet Brother Young<br />
And now I believe the revelations Brother Brigham, Brother Young<br />
I now believe your revelations, every one</p>
<p>Even the ones beyond all reason Brother Brigham, Brother Young<br />
Even the ones beyond all reason Brother Young<br />
For you&#8217;re the Lord&#8217;s own earthly prophet Brother Brigham, Brother Young<br />
And he’s simply testing in our faith o Brigham Young</p>
<p>My only hope for exaltation Brother Brigham, Brother Young<br />
My only chance for exaltation Brother Young<br />
Is to send me o&#8217;er the rim of the basin Brother Brigham, Brother Young<br />
The rim of the Great Salt Lake Basin Brother Young</p>
<p>For water cannot save me Brother Brigham, Brother Young<br />
Baptismal water cannot save me Brigham Young<br />
My sins are just too deep a dye o Brother Brigham, Brother Young<br />
My sins are just too deep a stain o Brother Young</p>
<p>So send Avenging Angels Brother Brigham, Brother Young<br />
Won&#8217;t you send Destroying Danites Brother Young<br />
To spill my blood upon the earth o Brother Brigham, Brother Young</p>
<p>So what do you think?</p>
<p>Do you find the song offensive?</p>
<p>Is it historicaly accurate of what may have happened to some of the saints in the salt lake valley?</p>
<p>Does it bare some similarites to what we have gone through in our day or not?</p>
<p><strong><br />
</strong></p>
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		<title>How to Provide Critical Feedback to Church Leaders Church Without Getting Excommunicated</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2009/10/15/how-to-provide-critical-feedback-to-church-leaders-church-without-getting-excommunicated/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2009/10/15/how-to-provide-critical-feedback-to-church-leaders-church-without-getting-excommunicated/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Oct 2009 09:00:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Andrew</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[apostles]]></category>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=7901</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[If you didn&#8217;t happen to read the February issue of Ensign Magazine in 1987, you missed some valuable instruction about how to provide critical feedback to Church leaders. Luckily for you, this post provides a second chance to get up to speed on what all would-be &#8220;improvers&#8221; in the Church should know about how to seek improving the Church without crossing any line that will forfeit your eternal exaltation and doom you to an eternity of teeth-gnashing with a TK smoothie. Over the past couple weeks here at Mormon Matters, we&#8217;ve had two posts discussing the need to be &#8220;improvers&#8221; in the Church rather than uncritical optimists or unloving pessimists, and suggesting some practical rules that would-be improvers should follow. Fortunately, our Church leaders have not left us to re-invent the wheel when it comes to figuring out what our options are when we disagree with their statements, policies, or practices. Below are excerpts from Elder Dallin H. Oaks&#8217; article entitled &#8220;Criticism,&#8221; which appeared in Ensign magazine in February of 1987. (You can read the full article here.) In this article, Elder Oaks straightforwardly informs Church members that there are two very different sets of rules when it comes to [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you didn&#8217;t happen to read the February issue of Ensign Magazine in 1987,  you missed some valuable instruction about how to provide critical feedback to Church leaders.  Luckily for you, this post provides a second chance to get up to speed on what all would-be &#8220;improvers&#8221; in the Church should know about how to seek improving the Church without crossing any line that will forfeit your eternal exaltation and doom you to an eternity of teeth-gnashing with a <a href="http://mormonmatters.org/2009/04/27/are-we-going-to-be-eunuchs-after-this-life/">TK smoothie</a>.<span id="more-7901"></span></p>
<p>Over the past couple weeks here at Mormon Matters, we&#8217;ve had two posts discussing <a href="http://mormonmatters.org/2009/10/01/are-there-any-loving-critics-left-in-the-church/">the need to be &#8220;improvers&#8221; in the Church rather than uncritical optimists or unloving pessimists</a>, and suggesting some <a href="http://mormonmatters.org/2009/10/09/so-you-want-to-be-an-improver/">practical rules that would-be improvers should follow</a>.  Fortunately, our Church leaders have not left us to re-invent the wheel when it comes to figuring out what our options are when we disagree with their statements, policies, or practices.</p>
<p>Below are excerpts from Elder Dallin H. Oaks&#8217; article entitled &#8220;Criticism,&#8221; which appeared in Ensign magazine in February of 1987.  (You can read the full article <a href="http://www.lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?hideNav=1&amp;locale=0&amp;sourceId=883267700817b010VgnVCM1000004d82620a____&amp;vgnextoid=2354fccf2b7db010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD">here</a>.)   In this article, Elder Oaks straightforwardly informs Church members that there are two very different sets of rules when it comes to publicly disclosing the truth and criticizing leaders or their decisions: (1) the rules that apply to the political and business worlds; and (2) the rules that apply to the Church.  According to Elder Oaks, it is essential for Church members to be aware of, and abide by, these two different sets of rules.  As you read these excerpts, I invite to you pay particular attention to the following ideas that Elder Oaks shares:</p>
<p>(1)  “&#8217;<span style="text-decoration: underline;">[T]he fact that something is true is not always a justification for communicating it</span>. . . .  The gist of Paul’s thought is that <span style="text-decoration: underline;">integrity is of no value in itself</span>.&#8217; . . .  <span style="text-decoration: underline;">The critical consideration is how we use the truth</span>. . . .  A Christian who has concern for others exercises care in how he uses the truth. Such care does not denigrate the truth; it ennobles it.  Truth surely exists as an absolute, but <span style="text-decoration: underline;">our <em>use</em> of truth should be disciplined by other values</span>. . . .&#8221;</p>
<p>(2) &#8220;<span style="text-decoration: underline;">The use of truth should also be constrained by the principle of unity</span>. . .  However, this caution to constrain the use of truth provides <span style="text-decoration: underline;">no justification for lying</span>. . . .  <span style="text-decoration: underline;">When truth is constrained by other virtues, the outcome is not falsehood but silence</span> for a season.&#8221;</p>
<p>(3) &#8220;Government or corporate officials, who are elected directly or indirectly or appointed by majority vote, must expect that their performance will be subject to critical and public evaluations by their constituents. . . . <span style="text-decoration: underline;">A different principle applies in our Church, where the selection of leaders is based on revelation, subject to the sustaining vote of the membership. In our system of Church government, evil speaking and criticism of leaders by members is always negative. Whether the criticism is true or not</span>, as Elder George F. Richards explained, it tends to impair the leaders’ influence and usefulness, thus working against the Lord and his cause.&#8221;</p>
<p>(4)  You&#8217;ll want to pay particular attention to the latter part of Elder Oaks&#8217; article where he presents five suggestions for how to appropriately deal with situations where we find ourselves disagreeing with Church leaders.</p>
<p>And now, without further ado, excerpts of Elder Oaks&#8217; Ensign article on Criticism:</p>
<blockquote><p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">I am persuaded that many do not understand the Church’s teachings about personal criticism, especially the criticism of Church leaders by Church members</span>.</p>
<p>I do not refer to the kind of criticism the dictionary defines as “the act of passing judgment as to the merits of anything.” (<em>Random House Dictionary,</em> unabridged ed., s.v. “criticism.”) . . .  Sports writers, reviewers of books and music, scholars, investment analysts, and those who test products and services must be free to exercise their critical faculties and to inform the public accordingly. This kind of criticism is usually directed toward issues, and it is usually constructive.</p>
<p>My cautions against criticism refer to another of its meanings, which the dictionary defines as “the act of passing severe judgment; censure; faultfinding.” (Ibid., s.v. “criticism.”) Faultfinding is “the act of pointing out faults, especially faults of a petty nature.” (Ibid., s.v. “faultfinding.”) It is related to “backbiting,” which means “to attack the character or reputation of [a person who is not present].” (Ibid., s.v. “backbite.”) This kind of criticism is generally directed toward persons, and it is generally destructive.</p>
<p>Faultfinding, evil speaking, and backbiting are obviously unchristian. . . .  The primary reason we are commanded to avoid criticism is to preserve our own spiritual well-being, not to protect the person whom we would criticize. . . .</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Does this counsel to avoid faultfinding and personal criticism apply only to statements that are false? Doesn’t it also apply to statements that are true?</span> In a talk I recently gave to Church Educational System teachers, I urged that “<span style="text-decoration: underline;">the fact that something is true is not always a justification for communicating it</span>.” A letter published in the <em>New York Times Magazine</em> described my counsel as “contempt for the truth.” (Feb. 9, 1986, p. 86.) I disagree. I rely on the teaching in Ecclesiastes: “To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven.” (<a class="scriptureRef" onclick="newWindow('http://scriptures.lds.org/eccl/3//1#1')" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/eccl/3/1#1" target="contentWindow">Eccl. 3:1</a>.) Specifically, there is “a time to speak,” and there is also “a time to keep silence.” (<a class="scriptureRef" onclick="newWindow('http://scriptures.lds.org/eccl/3//7#7')" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/eccl/3/7#7" target="contentWindow">Eccl. 3:7</a>.)</p>
<p>The counsel to mute our criticism is like the counsel the Apostle Paul gave to the Corinthian Saints to abstain from eating meat offered as sacrifices to idols. In truth, he taught, the idol was nothing. But since some of the members were weak and might misunderstand, those who knew the truth needed to “take heed lest by any means this liberty of yours become a stumblingblock to them that are weak.” (<a class="scriptureRef" onclick="newWindow('http://scriptures.lds.org/1_cor/8//9#9')" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/1_cor/8/9#9" target="contentWindow">1 Cor. 8:9</a>.) A Protestant theologian, Krister Stendahl, concludes: <span style="text-decoration: underline;">“The gist of Paul’s thought is that integrity is of no value in itself.</span>” (See <em>Paul Among Jews and Gentiles and Other Essays,</em> Philadelphia: Fortress, 1976, p. 61.)</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">The critical consideration is how we use the truth</span>. When he treated this same subject in his letter to the Romans, Paul said, “If thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou not charitably. Destroy him not with thy meat, for whom Christ died.” (<a class="scriptureRef" onclick="newWindow('http://scriptures.lds.org/rom/14//15#15')" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/rom/14/15#15" target="contentWindow">Rom. 14:15</a>.) <span style="text-decoration: underline;">A Christian who has concern for others exercises care in how he uses the truth</span>. Such care does not denigrate the truth; it ennobles it.</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Truth surely exists as an absolute, but our <em>use</em> of truth should be disciplined by other values</span>. . . .</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">The use of truth should also be constrained by the principle of unity</span>. One who focuses on faults, though they be true, fosters dissensions and divisions among fellow Church members in the body of Christ. . . .  In this dispensation, the Lord commanded that “Every man [should] esteem his brother as himself,” and declared that “If ye are not one ye are not mine.” (<a class="scriptureRef" onclick="newWindow('http://scriptures.lds.org/dc/38//25,27#25')" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/dc/38/25,27#25" target="contentWindow">D&amp;C 38:25, 27</a>.)</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">However, this caution to constrain the use of truth provides no justification for lying. The principles of love, unity, righteousness, and mercy do not condone falsehood</span>. The Lord commanded, “Thou shalt not bear false witness” (<a class="scriptureRef" onclick="newWindow('http://scriptures.lds.org/ex/20//16#16')" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/ex/20/16#16" target="contentWindow">Ex. 20:16</a>), and he has not revoked that command. <span style="text-decoration: underline;">When truth is constrained by other virtues, the outcome is not falsehood but silence for a season.</span> As the scriptures say, there is “a time to keep silence, and a time to speak.” (<a class="scriptureRef" onclick="newWindow('http://scriptures.lds.org/eccl/3//7#7')" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/eccl/3/7#7" target="contentWindow">Eccl. 3:7</a>.)</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">The counsel to avoid destructive personal criticism does not mean that Latter-day Saints need to be docile or indifferent to defective policies, deficient practices, or wrongful conduct in government or in private organizations in which we have an interest</span>. Our religious philosophy poses no obstacle to constructive criticism of such conditions. <span style="text-decoration: underline;">The gospel message is a continuing constructive criticism of all that is wretched or sordid in society</span>. <span style="text-decoration: underline;">But Christians who are commanded to be charitable and to “[speak] the truth in love” (<a class="scriptureRef" onclick="newWindow('http://scriptures.lds.org/eph/4//15#15')" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/eph/4/15#15" target="contentWindow">Eph. 4:15</a>) should avoid personal attacks and shrill denunciations</span>. Our public communications—even those protesting against deficiencies—should be reasoned in content and positive in spirit.</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Does the commandment to avoid faultfinding and evil speaking apply to Church members’ destructive personal criticism of Church leaders? Of course it does</span>. It applies to criticism of all Church leaders—local or general, male or female. In our relations with all of our Church leaders, we should follow the Apostle Paul’s direction: “Rebuke not an elder, but intreat him as a father.” (<a class="scriptureRef" onclick="newWindow('http://scriptures.lds.org/1_tim/5//1#1')" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/1_tim/5/1#1" target="contentWindow">1 Tim. 5:1</a>.) . . .</p>
<p>“Criticism is particularly objectionable when it is directed toward Church authorities, general or local. Jude condemns those who ‘speak evil of dignities.’ (<a class="scriptureRef" onclick="newWindow('http://scriptures.lds.org/jude/1//8#8')" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/jude/1/8#8" target="contentWindow">Jude 1:8</a>.) Evil speaking of the Lord’s anointed is in a class by itself. It is one thing to depreciate a person who exercises corporate power or even government power. It is quite another thing to criticize or depreciate a person for the performance of an office to which he or she has been called of God. . . .</p>
<p>Government or corporate officials, who are elected directly or indirectly or appointed by majority vote, must expect that their performance will be subject to critical and public evaluations by their constituents. That is part of the process of informing those who have the right and power of selection or removal. . . .</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">A different principle applies in our Church, where the selection of leaders is based on revelation, subject to the sustaining vote of the membership. In our system of Church government, evil speaking and criticism of leaders by members is always negative</span>. <span style="text-decoration: underline;">Whether the criticism is true or not, as Elder George F. Richards explained, it tends to impair the leaders’ influence and usefulness, thus working against the Lord and his cause</span>. . . .</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">So what do we do when we feel that our Relief Society president or our bishop or another authority is transgressing or pursuing a policy of which we disapprove? Is there no remedy? Are our critics correct when they charge that members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints are “sheep” without remedy against the whims of a heedless or even an evil shepherd?</span></p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">There are remedies, but they are not the same remedies or procedures that are used with leaders in other organizations</span>.</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Our Father in Heaven has not compelled us to think the same way on every subject or procedure. As we seek to accomplish our life’s purposes, we will inevitably have differences with those around us—including some of those we sustain as our leaders. The question is not whether we have such differences, but how we manage them</span>. What the Lord has said on another subject is also true of the management of differences with his leaders: “It must needs be done in mine own way.” (<a class="scriptureRef" onclick="newWindow('http://scriptures.lds.org/dc/104//16#16')" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/dc/104/16#16" target="contentWindow">D&amp;C 104:16</a>.) We should conduct ourselves in such a way that our thoughts and actions do not cause us to lose the companionship of the Spirit of the Lord.</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">The first principle in the gospel procedure for managing differences is to keep our personal differences private</span>. In this we have worthy examples to follow. Every student of Church history knows that there have been differences of opinion among Church leaders since the Church was organized. Each of us has experienced such differences in our work in auxiliaries, quorums, wards, stakes, and missions of the Church. <span style="text-decoration: underline;">We know that such differences are discussed, but not in public</span>. Counselors acquiesce in the decisions of their president. Teachers follow the direction of their presidency. Members are loyal to the counsel of their bishop. All of this is done quietly and loyally—even by members who would have done differently if they had been in the position of authority.</p>
<p>Why aren’t these differences discussed in public? <span style="text-decoration: underline;">Public debate—the means of resolving differences in a democratic government—is not appropriate in our Church government</span>. We are all subject to the authority of the called and sustained servants of the Lord. They and we are all governed by the direction of the Spirit of the Lord, and that Spirit only functions in an atmosphere of unity. That is why personal differences about Church doctrine or procedure need to be worked out privately. <span style="text-decoration: underline;">There is nothing inappropriate about private communications concerning such differences, provided they are carried on in a spirit of love</span>.</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">There are at least five different procedures a Church member can follow in addressing differences with Church leaders—general or local, male or female</span>.</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">The first—and most benign—of the procedures is to overlook the difference</span>. President Brigham Young described his own application of this method in a circumstance in which he felt “a want of confidence” in the Prophet Joseph Smith’s financial management. After entertaining such thoughts for a short time, President Young saw that they could cause him to lose confidence in the Prophet and ultimately to question God as well. President Young concluded:</p>
<p>“Though I admitted in my feelings and knew all the time that Joseph was a human being and subject to err, still it was none of my business to look after his faults. … He was called of God; God dictated him, and if He had a mind to leave him to himself and let him commit an error, that was no business of mine. … He was God’s servant, and not mine.” (<em>Journal of Discourses,</em> 4:297.) . . .</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">A second option is to reserve judgment and postpone any action on the difference</span>. In many instances, the actions we are tempted to criticize may be based on confidences that preclude the leader from explaining his or her actions publicly. In such instances there is wisdom in a strategy of patience and trust.</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">The third procedure, which should be familiar to every student of the Bible, is to take up our differences privately with the leader involved</span>. The Savior taught: “If thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.” (<a class="scriptureRef" onclick="newWindow('http://scriptures.lds.org/matt/18//15#15')" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/matt/18/15#15" target="contentWindow">Matt. 18:15</a>.)</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">This course of action may be pursued in a private meeting, if possible, or it may be done through a letter or other indirect communication</span>. How many differences could be resolved if we would only communicate privately about them! Some would disappear as they were identified as mere misunderstandings. Others would be postponed with an agreement to disagree for the present. But in many instances, private communications about differences would remove obstacles to individual growth and correction.</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">A fourth option is to communicate with the Church officer who has the power to correct or release the person thought to be in error or transgression</span>. The Bible calls this “tell[ing] it unto the church.” (<a class="scriptureRef" onclick="newWindow('http://scriptures.lds.org/matt/18//17#17')" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/matt/18/17#17" target="contentWindow">Matt. 18:17</a>.) Modern scripture, in the revelation we call “the law of the Church,” describes this procedure:</p>
<p>“And if he or she confess not thou shalt deliver him or her up unto the church, not to the members, but to the elders. And it shall be done in a meeting, and that not before the world.” (<a class="scriptureRef" onclick="newWindow('http://scriptures.lds.org/dc/42//89#89')" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/dc/42/89#89" target="contentWindow">D&amp;C 42:89</a>.)</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Note the caution that this remedy is to be private—“not before the world</span>.” This is not done in order to hide the facts, but rather to increase the chance that the correction will improve the life of a brother or sister. . . .</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">There is a fifth remedy. We can pray for the resolution of the problem</span>. We should pray for the leader whom we think to be in error, asking the Lord to correct the circumstance if it needs correction. <span style="text-decoration: underline;">At the same time, we should pray for ourselves, asking the Lord to correct us if we are in error</span>. . . .</p>
<p>All five of these are appropriate options for Church members who differ with their leaders. The preferred course depends upon the circumstances and the inspiration that guides those who prayerfully seek. . . .</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Despite the commandments and counsel I have reviewed, we have some members who persistently and publicly criticize Church leaders. What about them?</span> . . .</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Just as our Church leaders’ source of authority is different from that of government and corporate leaders, so are the procedures for correcting Church leaders different from those used to correct leaders chosen by popular election</span>. But the differences are appropriate to the way in which our Church leaders are called and released. By following approved procedures, we can keep from alienating ourselves from the Spirit of the Lord.</p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">This counsel will be anathema to some. I invite those who are troubled by it to consider it in terms of the teachings of the scriptures rather than in terms of their personal preferences or the canons of any particular profession. Those who reject the authority of the scriptures or our latter-day prophets cannot be expected to agree with what I have said</span>. Those who see freedom or truth as absolutely overriding principles in all human actions cannot be expected to be persuaded by the scriptures’ teaching that “knowledge puffeth up, but charity edifieth.” (<a class="scriptureRef" onclick="newWindow('http://scriptures.lds.org/1_cor/8//1#1')" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/1_cor/8/1#1" target="contentWindow">1 Cor. 8:1</a>.)</p>
<p>Those who govern their thoughts and actions solely by the principles of liberalism or conservatism or intellectualism cannot be expected to agree with all of the teachings of the gospel of Jesus Christ. <span style="text-decoration: underline;">As for me, I find some wisdom in liberalism, some wisdom in conservatism, and much truth in intellectualism—but I find no salvation in any of them</span>.</p>
<p>. . . <span style="text-decoration: underline;">It is easy to preach freedom or truth. Praise for those subjects is usually safe and always popular. It is infinitely more difficult to preach how men and women should <em>use</em> freedom or truth. The preacher of that message may command respect, but he or she will not win popularity</span>.</p>
<p>I conclude with a message of hope. When Isaiah condemned the critics of his day, he concluded with a prophecy. He said that in time the children of God would sanctify his name and “fear the God of Israel.” Continuing, he declared, “They also that erred in spirit shall come to understanding, and they that murmured shall learn doctrine.” (<a class="scriptureRef" onclick="newWindow('http://scriptures.lds.org/isa/29//23-24#23')" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/isa/29/23-24#23" target="contentWindow">Isa. 29:23–24</a>.) In that spirit I pray for the day when all of us will know God and keep his commandments. In that day, as Isaiah foretold, the “king shall reign in righteousness,” and “the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever.” (<a class="scriptureRef" onclick="newWindow('http://scriptures.lds.org/isa/32//1,17#1')" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/isa/32/1,17#1" target="contentWindow">Isa. 32:1, 17</a>.)</p></blockquote>
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		<title>Did Elder Holland Denounce or Carefully Avoid the &#8220;Inspired Fiction&#8221; Theory?</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2009/10/07/did-elder-holland-denounce-or-intentionally-avoid-the-inspired-fiction-theory/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2009/10/07/did-elder-holland-denounce-or-intentionally-avoid-the-inspired-fiction-theory/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Oct 2009 09:07:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Andrew</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[apostles]]></category>
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		<category><![CDATA[General Conference]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[historicity]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[joseph]]></category>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=7796</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[If someone can find something in the Book of Mormon, anything that they love or respond to or find dear, I applaud that and say more power to you. That&#8217;s what I find, too. And that should not in any way discount somebody&#8217;s liking a passage here or a passage there or the whole idea of the book, but not agreeing to its origin, its divinity. . . . [W]e have many people who are members of the church who do not have some burning conviction as to its origins, who have some other feeling about it that is not as committed to foundational statements and the premises of Mormonism. But we&#8217;re not going to invite somebody out of the church over that any more than we would anything else about degrees of belief or steps of hope or steps of conviction. . . . We would say: &#8220;This is the way I see it, and this is the faith I have; this is the foundation on which I&#8217;m going forward. If I can help you work toward that I&#8217;d be glad to, but I don&#8217;t love you less; I don&#8217;t distance you more; I don&#8217;t say you&#8217;re unacceptable to [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p><img class="alignright size-thumbnail wp-image-7825" title="hollandp" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/hollandp-150x140.jpg" alt="hollandp" width="150" height="140" /><em>If someone can find something in the Book of Mormon, anything that they love or respond to or find dear, I applaud that and say more power to you. That&#8217;s what I find, too. And that should not in any way discount somebody&#8217;s liking a passage here or a passage there or the whole idea of the book, but not agreeing to its origin, its divinity. . . .  [W]e have many people who are members of the church who do not have some burning conviction as to its origins, who have some other feeling about it that is not as committed to foundational statements and the premises of Mormonism. But we&#8217;re not going to invite somebody out of the church over that any more than we would anything else about degrees of belief or steps of hope or steps of conviction. . . . We would say: &#8220;This is the way I see it, and this is the faith I have; this is the foundation on which I&#8217;m going forward. If I can help you work toward that I&#8217;d be glad to, but I don&#8217;t love you less; I don&#8217;t distance you more; I don&#8217;t say you&#8217;re unacceptable to me as a person or even as a Latter-day Saint if you can&#8217;t make that step or move to the beat of that drum.&#8221; . . .  We really don&#8217;t want to sound smug. We don&#8217;t want to seem uncompromising and insensitive. -Elder Jeffrey R. Holland, Mar. 6, 2006. (</em><a href="http://www.pbs.org/mormons/interviews/holland.html"><em>Source</em></a><em>.)</em></p></blockquote>
<blockquote><p><em>I testify that one cannot come to full faith in this Latter-day work and thereby find the fullest measure of peace and comfort in these our times until he or she embraces the divinity of the Book of Mormon and the Lord Jesus Christ of whom it testifies. If anyone is foolish enough or misled enough to reject 531 pages of a heretofore unknown text, teeming with literary and Semitic complexity, without honestly attempting to account for the origin of those pages somehow&#8211;especially without accounting for their powerful witness of Jesus Christ and the profound spiritual impact that witness has had on what is now tens of millions of readers&#8211;if that&#8217;s the case then such persons, elect or otherwise, have been deceived. And if they leave this Church, they must to do so by crawling over, or under, or around the Book of Mormon to make their exit.&#8221; -Elder Jeffrey R. Holland, Oct. 4, 2009.  (</em><a href="http://broadcast.lds.org/genconf/2009/10/50/GC_2009_10_503_HollandJR___eng_.wmv"><em>Source</em></a><em>.)</em></p></blockquote>
<p>When Elder Holland delivered his stinging rebuke to Book of Mormon critics in his General Conference address last Sunday, reactions ranged from <a href="http://bycommonconsent.com/2009/10/04/sunday-afternoon-general-conference-the-only-true-and-living-session-with-which-the-nacle-is-well-pleased/">&#8220;woots&#8221; and &#8220;double woots&#8221;</a> by literalist believers of the Book of Mormon, to disappointment by those who felt Elder Holland was backtracking on his prior statement that Church members who don&#8217;t believe the traditional story of its origins should <em>not</em> be considered &#8220;unacceptable . . . as a Latter-day Saint if [they] can&#8217;t make that step or move to the beat of that drum.&#8221;  However, after listening carefully to Elder Holland&#8217;s address again, I think both camps might be mistaken about what Elder Holland was intending to say, particularly with regard to the &#8220;Inspired Fiction&#8221; theory of the Book of Mormon.<span id="more-7796"></span></p>
<p><strong><em>The Inspired Fiction Theory and Its Scriptural Precedents</em></strong></p>
<p><img class="alignright size-thumbnail wp-image-7832" title="jonah-whale" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/jonah-whale-150x150.jpg" alt="jonah-whale" width="150" height="150" />For those who may not be familiar with the Inspired Fiction theory, it goes something like this:  Scripture is a vehicle that teaches us divine truths through the medium of divinely-inspired stories which are oftentimes fictional. Just a few of the more obvious examples would be the parables contained in the New Testament, or the fantastic stories in the Old Testament (Noah and the Ark, Moses&#8217; divine cursing of Egypt, Jonah living three days in the belly of a whale, etc.).  These seemingly obvious examples of divinely-inspired fiction are no less important or valuable as sources of divine guidance than had they been literally true.  For example, the stories of the Prodigal Son or the Good Samaritan do not have to be based on literal historic events to have spiritual value.  Moreover, the fact that Jesus openly used fictional stories to teach timeless truths establishes an example and a pattern of God teaching his children spiritual truths through stories that are not grounded in literal, historic fact.</p>
<p>Latter-day Saint Apostles and scholars have embraced the notion that scripture may be divinely-inspired fiction.  For example, Apostle Parley P. Pratt stated that the Creation story was the equivalent of a child&#8217;s fable because humankind has not been intellectually equipped throughout the ages to understand its true origins.  (See <em>Temples of the Most High</em>.)</p>
<p><img class="alignright size-thumbnail wp-image-7833" title="fac1" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/fac1-150x150.gif" alt="fac1" width="150" height="150" />Moreover, faithful LDS scholars who have examined the surviving Egyptian papyri that were in Joseph Smith&#8217;s possession (which contain the facsimiles that appear in the Book of Abraham <a href="http://mi.byu.edu/publications/books/?bookid=40&amp;chapid=168">but which date from around 100 &#8211; 250 B.C. rather than from Abraham&#8217;s much earlier era</a>) have theorized that perhaps the Book of Abraham was not <em>translated</em> from Egyptian papyri even though Joseph Smith said it was, but rather, that the Book of Abraham was a divine revelation that Joseph was able to receive only after his mind was opened and prepared to receive it by examining the Egyptian papyri in his possession. (<a href="http://en.fairmormon.org/Book_of_Abraham/Papyri/FAQ">Source</a>.)  In other words, faithful LDS scholars hypothesize that despite Joseph&#8217;s claim that the Book of Abraham was &#8220;A Translation of some ancient Records, that have fallen into our hands from the catacombs of Egypt—The writings of Abraham while he was in Egypt, called the Book of Abraham, written by his own hand, upon papyrus,&#8221; the papyrus merely served as a &#8220;catalyst&#8221; to inspire a divine revelation that was, in fact, <em>not</em> contained on the Egyptian papyri in his possession.  (<a href="http://en.fairmormon.org/Book_of_Abraham/Papyri/FAQ">Source</a>.)  These LDS scholars feel comfortable with this possibility because, as one LDS apologetics forum explains: &#8220;Joseph used the word &#8216;<em>translation</em>&#8216; to mean several things, <em>including the process of receiving pure revelation</em>. (Joseph Smith&#8217;s revelations call his revision of the Bible a &#8220;translation&#8221; (<a style="text-decoration: none; color: #3366bb; background-image: url(http://en.fairmormon.org/wiki/skins/monobook/external.png); background-repeat: no-repeat; background-attachment: initial; -webkit-background-clip: initial; -webkit-background-origin: initial; background-color: initial; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 13px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; background-position: 100% 50%;" title="http://scriptures.lds.org/en/search?search=D%26C+73%3A4%3B+D%26C+76%3A15%3B+D%26C+90%3A13%3B+D%26C+94%3A10%3B+D%26C+124%3A89" rel="nofollow" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/en/search?search=D%26C+73%3A4%3B+D%26C+76%3A15%3B+D%26C+90%3A13%3B+D%26C+94%3A10%3B+D%26C+124%3A89">D&amp;C 73:4; 76:15; 90:13; 94:10; 124</a>), even though he didn&#8217;t use any Hebrew of Greek manuscripts. Also, D&amp;C 7 is a revealed translation of a lost record written by the Apostle John.)&#8221;  (<a href="http://en.fairmormon.org/Book_of_Abraham/Papyri/FAQ">Source</a>.)  Again, it is worth emphasizing that, according to faithful LDS apologists, Joseph Smith is known to have used the word &#8220;translation&#8221; to mean &#8220;the process of receiving pure revelation,&#8221; as opposed to literally translating words in an ancient record from one language to another.  (<a href="http://en.fairmormon.org/Book_of_Abraham/Papyri/FAQ">Source</a>.)  Thus, faithful LDS scholars have no qualms with the possibility that Joseph may have <em>thought</em> he was producing a &#8220;translation&#8221; of an ancient record when in reality he was receiving and recording &#8220;pure revelation&#8221; that was <em>unconnected</em> to any ancient record, even when a physical object such as Egyptian papyri were present.  The overall concept is that Joseph&#8217;s revelations were divinely inspired <em>even if he didn&#8217;t completely understand the process</em> through which those revelations were received.</p>
<p><strong><em>Resistance to, and Acceptance of, the Inspired Fiction Theory</em></strong></p>
<p><img class="alignright size-thumbnail wp-image-7834" title="liahona" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/liahona-150x150.jpg" alt="liahona" width="150" height="150" />When it comes to applying this same sort of theory to the Book of Mormon, however, the resistance sometimes becomes fierce.  It seems most LDS leaders and scholars are unwilling to extend this same theory to the Book of Mormon, and are deeply disturbed by any suggestion that the Book of Mormon represents anything less than an actual <em>translation</em> of Reformed Egyptian characters into English taken from an <em>actual historical record</em> written by <em>real persons </em>living anciently in the Middle East and on the American continent.  It is worth noting that this resistance to the Inspired Fiction theory persists even though LDS scholars now believe Joseph Smith and his contemporary Latter-day Saints were <em>mistaken</em> when they made many statements indicating their belief that the Book of Mormon accounts had taken place over large swaths of the North American continent.  (<a href="http://www.fairlds.org/FAIR_Brochures/Where_Did_the_Book_of_Mormon_Take_Place.pdf">Source</a>.)</p>
<p>In summary, most LDS scholars are comfortable stating that Joseph Smith did not actually <em>&#8220;translate&#8221;</em> the Book of Abraham and the Bible as that word is commonly understood, and that he was <em>mistaken</em> in thinking that the Book of Mormon accounts took place over large swaths of the North American continent (rather than a relatively small area in Guatemala and southern Mexico), but they are <em>unwilling</em> to allow for the possibility that Joseph Smith also <em>mistakenly</em> believed the Book of Mormon was a <em>translation</em> of an actual ancient record.</p>
<p>Some may ask: Why resist applying the Inspired Fiction theory to the Book of Mormon?  Why resist the idea that God inspired Joseph Smith to dictate the Book of Mormon to teach us divine truths through the medium of divinely-inspired stories that are equally fictional but no less valuable than the parables of Jesus?  Why resist the idea that Lehi, Nephi and others were divinely-inspired characters in a grand divine novel rather than real persons who actually lived in the ancient Americas?  Why resist the idea that Joseph mistakenly thought the Book of Mormon was a &#8220;translation&#8221; of an ancient record written by actual ancient prophets, similar to his mistakenly thinking he was translating the Egyptian papyri in his possession when he received the revelation that is the Book of Abraham?  In a prior interview, Elder Holland explained why he has difficulty embracing the Inspired Fiction theory:</p>
<blockquote>
<p style="color: #333333;"><img class="alignright size-thumbnail wp-image-7837" title="Moroni_and_Joseph2" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/Moroni_and_Joseph2-150x150.jpg" alt="Moroni_and_Joseph2" width="150" height="150" /><span style="color: #000000;">Now, in terms of more modern theories, there are those who say it&#8217;s more mythical literature and spiritual, and not literal. That doesn&#8217;t work for me. I don&#8217;t understand that, and I can&#8217;t go very far with that, because Joseph Smith said there were plates, and he said there was an angel. And if there weren&#8217;t plates and there wasn&#8217;t an angel, I have a bigger problem than whether the Book of Mormon is rich literature. . . . I have to go with what the prophet said about the book, about its origins, about the literalness of the plates, the literalness of the vision &#8212; and then the product speaks for itself.</span></p>
<p><span style="color: #000000;">I don&#8217;t think we&#8217;re through examining the depth, the richness, the profundity, the complexity, all of the literary and historical and religious issues that go into that book. I think we&#8217;re still young at doing that. But the origins for me are the origins that the prophet Joseph said: a set of plates, given by an angel, translated by the gift and power of God. . . . (<a href="http://www.pbs.org/mormons/interviews/holland.html">Source</a>.)</span></p></blockquote>
<p>However, some LDS scholars, usually those whose conclusions fall outside the &#8220;mainstream&#8221; of what Church leaders and Church-funded scholars are comfortable accepting, view the Inspired Fiction theory as a favorable &#8220;middle ground&#8221; position where Latter-day Saints can continue to reverence the Book of Mormon as divinely-inspired scripture without having to believe it is an actual translation of an actual ancient record written by real people, and thereby avoiding the numerous challenges to the Book of Mormon&#8217;s historicity that currently keep a team of Church-funded scholars employed to research and respond to.   However, as LDS scholar Louis Midgley has explained, such a &#8220;middle ground&#8221; position is harmful to the Church&#8217;s tradition and interests:</p>
<blockquote><p>Some may ask: why not find a way to reduce the controversy over the Book of Mormon? What harm can such an accommodation do? The reasons for rejecting such compromises seem obvious to me. For one thing, the Book of Mormon is, more than anything else, what keeps the Church of Jesus Christ from becoming just another Protestant sect or social welfare agency. Its existence makes of Joseph Smith something other than a mere quaint or colorful example in a line of Christian primitivists or restorationists. In addition, the Book of Mormon was what witnessed to those who first became members of the fledgling Church of Christ that Joseph Smith wore the mantle of a genuine prophet, as it does to those who are currently believing and practicing Latter-day Saints. And its existence has, more than any other single thing, right from the beginning, distinguished the Latter-day Saints from various brands of Protestant sectarian religiosity. (<a href="http://mi.byu.edu/publications/review/?vol=6&amp;num=1&amp;id=140">Source</a>.)</p></blockquote>
<p><strong><em>Did Elder Holland Denounce or Carefully Avoid the Inspired Fiction Theory?</em></strong></p>
<p>Though it is clear that Elder Holland&#8217;s recent Conference address denounced all theories that portray Joseph Smith as having <em>knowingly</em> <em>fabricated</em> a book that he <em>knew</em> was <em>not</em> <em>divinely-inspired</em>, it is less clear to me after carefully listening to Elder Holland&#8217;s talk whether he was likewise intending to denounce the Inspired Fiction theory that portrays Joseph as receiving and dictating a <em>divinely-inspired </em>but fictional history of Israelites emigrating to and settling in ancient America as a medium for conveying spiritual truths and doctrines that promote the happiness, peace, and spiritual well-being of humankind.  As you read the portions of Elder Holland&#8217;s address quoted below, it is important to keep in mind the distinction between what Elder Holland personally believes about the Book of Mormon, and what he is comfortable allowing other faithful Latter-day Saints to believe about its origins (as we see reflected in the very first Holland quote above).  Although it is clear that Elder Holland <em>personally</em> believes the Book of Mormon is an actual translation of an actual ancient historical record, and although it is likewise clear he finds it utterly unacceptable for any Latter-day Saint to believe that Joseph Smith <em>knowingly</em>, and therefore <em>deceptively</em>, <em>fabricated</em> the Book of Mormon, ask yourself as you read Elder Holland&#8217;s remarks whether he allows for faithful Latter-day Saints to believe that the Book of Mormon was <em>divinely-inspired</em>, but that Joseph was simply <em>mistaken</em> in saying it was a translation of an actual physical historical record (as LDS scholars are willing to accept when it comes to the Book of Abraham and the Egyptian papyri Joseph Smith believed he was &#8220;translating&#8221;).   For example, when Elder Holland states that Latter-day Saints are &#8220;<em>deceived</em>&#8221; unless they believe in the &#8220;<em>divinity</em>&#8221; of the Book of Mormon, does that mean he feels Latter-day Saints are deceived if they believe it is <em>divinely-inspired</em> fiction?</p>
<p>In my view, Elder Holland selected his words very carefully, I suspect for the purpose of allowing faithful Latter-day Saints to hold a position that he personally does not share: that the Book of Mormon was <em>divinely-inspired, </em>but that Joseph did not recognize its stories as being <em>fictional</em> (again, similar to LDS apologists&#8217; theory that Joseph <em>mistakenly</em> believed the Book of Abraham was an actual translation of an actual historical record, rather than <em>knowingly lying</em> about it, and similar to LDS apologists&#8217; assertion that Joseph was <em>mistaken</em> in believing that the Book of Mormon actually took place over large swaths of North America, rather than <em>knowingly lying</em> about it).  And now, without further ado, the relevant portions of Elder Holland&#8217;s talk (as transcribed by me from the audio recording):</p>
<blockquote><p>There is one kind of latter-day destruction that has always sounded to me more personal than public, more individual than collective, a warning perhaps more applicable inside the Church than outside it.  The Savior warned in the last days, even those of the covenant, the very elect, could be deceived by the enemy of truth. . . .  [Elder Holland then identifies the Book of Mormon as a source of divine guidance in the Latter-days, summarizes Lehi's dream, focusing on the rod of iron and the mists of darkness, and relates a story of Hyrum reading a Book of Mormon passage to bring comfort to the party on their way to Carthage jail.]</p>
<p><img class="alignright size-thumbnail wp-image-7840" title="smith-carthage-martyrdom_MD" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/smith-carthage-martyrdom_MD-150x150.jpg" alt="smith-carthage-martyrdom_MD" width="150" height="150" />Later, when actually incarcerated in the jail, Joseph the Prophet turned to the guards that held him captive and bore a powerful testimony of the <em>divine authenticity</em> of the Book of Mormon.  Shortly thereafter, pistol and ball would take the lives of these two testators. As one of a thousand elements of my own testimony of the <em>divinity</em> of the Book of Mormon, I submit this as yet one more evidence of its <em>truthfulness</em>.  In this their greatest and last hour of need, I ask you, would these men blaspheme before God by continuing to fix their lives, their honor, and their own search for eternal salvation on a book, and by implication a church and a ministry, they had fictitiously created out of whole cloth?!  . . . [A]nd tell me, whether in this hour of death, these two men would enter the presence of their eternal judge, quoting from, and finding solace in, a book which if not the very <em>word of God</em> would brand them as impostors and charlatans until the end of time.  They would not do that!   They were willing to die, rather than deny the <em>divine origin</em> and the <em>eternal truthfulness</em> of the Book of Mormon.</p></blockquote>
<p>Elder Holland&#8217;s choice of words above is interesting.  A Latter-day Saint who believes the Book of Mormon represents divinely-inspired fiction would whole-heartedly agree with his remarks about the Book of Mormon&#8217;s &#8220;divine authenticity,&#8221; &#8220;divinity,&#8221; &#8220;truthfulness,&#8221; &#8220;divine origin,&#8221; and &#8220;eternal truthfulness,&#8221; in the same way he or she would embrace the &#8220;divine authenticity&#8221; and &#8220;divine origin&#8221; and &#8220;eternal truthfulness&#8221; of Jesus&#8217; parables or any number of the fantastic stories in the Old Testatment.  Moreover, when Elder Holland uses the word &#8220;fictitiously&#8221; above, it&#8217;s seems he almost certainly means that Joseph would not have <em>knowingly</em> fictitiously created the Book of Mormon, as opposed to his receiving a divine revelation that he did not <em>recognize</em> as being a fictional spiritual history (again, in the same way LDS apologists hypothesize with regard to the Book of Abraham).  This line of thought continues in the next paragraph, where he denounces the various theories that portray Joseph as <em>knowingly</em> plagiarizing from other works to create the Book of Mormon, or <em>knowingly</em> fabricating it out of whole cloth:</p>
<blockquote><p>Failed theories about its origins have been born, parroted, and died.  From Ethan Smith to Solomon Spaulding, to deranged paranoid to cunning genius.  None of these frankly pathetic answers for this book has ever withstood examination because there is no other answer than the one Joseph gave as its young, unlearned translator. . .  .  &#8220;No wicked man could write such a book as this, and no good man would write it, unless it were true, and he were commanded of God to do so.&#8221;   I testify that one cannot come to full faith in this Latter-day work and thereby find the fullest measure of peace and comfort in these our times until he or she <em>embraces the </em><em>divinity</em> of the Book of Mormon and the Lord Jesus Christ of whom it testifies.  If anyone is foolish enough or misled enough to reject 531 pages of a heretofore unknown text, teeming with literary and Semitic complexity, without honestly attempting to account for the origin of those pages somehow&#8211;especially without accounting for their powerful witness of Jesus Christ and the profound spiritual impact that witness has had on what is now tens of millions of readers&#8211;if that&#8217;s the case then such persons, elect or otherwise, have been <em>deceived</em>.  And if they leave this Church, they must to do so by crawling over, or under, or around the Book of Mormon to make their exit.</p></blockquote>
<p>Again, I do not see anything here that should cause Latter-day Saints who ascribe to the Inspired Fiction theory of the Book of Mormon&#8217;s origins to feel as if they&#8217;ve been pronounced &#8220;deceived&#8221; by Elder Holland.  While he obviously sees &#8220;Semitic complexity&#8221; in the Book of Mormon, which he plainly relies upon to support his personal view that it represents literal history, he does so in the context of denouncing those those who deny the Book of Mormon&#8217;s <em>divinity</em>.  Of course, those who ascribe to the Inspired Fiction are in full agreement with Elder Holland about the <em>divinity</em> of the Book of Mormon, and could further believe that any genuine &#8220;Semitic complexity&#8221; within its pages was <em>divinely-inspired</em> as well.</p>
<p><img class="alignright size-thumbnail wp-image-7829" title="2009_gardner_02" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/2009_gardner_02-150x150.jpg" alt="2009_gardner_02" width="150" height="150" />Elder Holland then cited as support for his position that witnesses to the Gold Plates, some of whom were later sometimes hostile to Joseph, testified to their death that they had seen an angel and had handled the Gold Plates by the power of God and not the power of man.  Thus, Elder Holland plainly believes in the literal existence of Gold Plates, and views them as being the source material for the Book of Mormon, along with &#8220;gift and power of God&#8221; to translate them.  However, there is no plain denunciation of those who believe the Gold Plates could have been an angelically-provided object that served as a catalyst to open and prepare Joseph&#8217;s mind to receive the Book of Mormon through revelation, in the same way that LDS apologists posit Joseph received the &#8220;pure revelation&#8221; of the Book of Abraham after examining the catalyst to that revelation, namely, the Egyptian papyri in his possession.  Moreover, this would explain the accounts where Joseph &#8220;translated&#8221; the Book of Mormon while he gazed into a seer stone placed in his hat, rather than by reading from the characters on the Gold Plates.  (<a href="http://www.fairlds.org/FAIR_Conferences/2009_Joseph_the_Seer.html">Source</a>.)</p>
<p>Elder Holland continues:</p>
<blockquote><p><img class="alignright size-thumbnail wp-image-7841" title="FribergMormonFarewell" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/FribergMormonFarewell-150x150.jpg" alt="FribergMormonFarewell" width="150" height="150" />Now, I did not sail with the brother of Jared . . .  . I did not hear King Benjamin speak his angelically-delivered sermon.  I did not proselyte with Alma and Amulek . . . .  I was not among the Nephite crowd who touched the wounds of the resurrected Lord, nor did I weep with Mormon and Moroni over the destruction of an entire civilization.   But my testimony of this record and the peace it brings to the human heart is as binding and unequivocal as was theirs.  Like them, I give my name unto the world to witness unto the world of that which I have seen, and like them, I lie not,  God bearing witness of it.</p></blockquote>
<p>I suppose one could read the quote above cynically to mean that Elder Holland said he didn&#8217;t do any of these things because they never actually happened, but I don&#8217;t believe for a second that was his intended meaning.  It seems this passage again demonstrates Elder Holland&#8217;s belief that these were actual historic events.  But is that the equivalent of saying that those Latter-day Saints who do not share that belief are <em>&#8220;deceived&#8221;? </em>I personally don&#8217;t think so, because when he referred to Latter-day Saints being &#8220;deceived&#8221; about the Book of Mormon earlier in his remarks, he did so in the context of identifying those who deny the Book of Mormon&#8217;s <em>divinity.</em> Moreover, if at any point in his talk Elder Holland intended to say that faithful Latter-day Saints <em>must</em> believe the Book of Mormon is a <em>literal historical account of real people</em>, he could easily have just said so.  For example, he could have easily testified to the Book of Mormon&#8217;s &#8220;historical truthfulness&#8221; or &#8220;historical authenticity&#8221; but instead, he chose to testify of its &#8220;<em>divinity</em>&#8221; and &#8220;<em>eternal truthfulness</em>.&#8221;</p>
<p>Elder Holland concluded with his personal testimony of the Book of Mormon:</p>
<blockquote><p>I want it absolutely clear when I stand before the judgment bar of God that I declared to the world in the most straightforward language I can summon, that the Book of Mormon is <em>true</em>, that <em>it came forth the way Joseph said it came forth</em>, and was given to bring happiness and hope to the faithful in the travail of the last days.  My witness echoes that of Nephi, who wrote part of the book in his last days, &#8220;hearken unto <span class="searchword">these</span> <span class="searchword">words</span> and <span class="searchword">believe</span> <span class="searchword">in</span> <span class="searchword">Christ</span>; and <span class="searchword">if</span> <span class="searchword">ye</span> <span class="searchword">believe</span> not <span class="searchword">in</span> <span class="searchword">these</span> <span class="searchword">words</span> <span class="searchword">believe</span> <span class="searchword">in</span> <span class="searchword">Christ</span>.  And <span class="searchword">if</span> <span class="searchword">ye</span> <span class="searchword">shall</span> <span class="searchword">believe</span> <span class="searchword">in</span> <span class="searchword">Christ</span> <span class="searchword">ye</span> will <span class="searchword">believe</span> <span class="searchword">in</span> <span class="searchword">these</span> <span class="searchword">words</span>, for they are the <span class="searchword">words</span> of <span class="searchword">Christ</span>, . . . and they teach all men that they should do good.  And <span class="searchword">if</span> they are not the <span class="searchword">words</span> of <span class="searchword">Christ</span>, judge <span class="searchword">ye</span>—for <span class="searchword">Christ</span> will show unto you, with power and great glory, that they are his <span class="searchword">words</span>, at the last day.</p>
<p>Remember this declaration by Jesus himself: &#8220;Whoso treasureth up my word shall not be decieved.&#8221; And in the last days, neither your heart nor faith will fail you.   Of this I earnestly testify, in the name of Jesus Christ, Amen</p></blockquote>
<p>Once again, a Latter-day Saint who ascribes to the Inspired Fiction theory would have no problem echoing Elder Holland&#8217;s testimony that the Book of Mormon is &#8220;true&#8221; any more than the average LDS apologist would bristle at the suggestion that that the parables of Jesus, or the Book of Abraham or the Joseph Smith&#8221;translation&#8221; of the Bible, are &#8220;true&#8221;&#8211;even though those are all recognized by LDS apologists as potentially being divinely-inspired fiction and not literal translations of actual historical records in Joseph&#8217;s possession.</p>
<p>Finally, I can&#8217;t help noting what I feel must have been carefully chosen wording by Elder Holland in saying that the Book of Mormon &#8220;came forth the way Joseph said it came forth.&#8221;  This language struck me because it reminded me of a passage in an official Church text book used in CES Institute and BYU Religion classes, <em>Church History in the Fullness of Times</em>:</p>
<blockquote><p><img class="alignright size-thumbnail wp-image-7842" title="Translating" src="http://mormonmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/Translating-150x150.jpg" alt="Translating" width="150" height="150" /><em>Little is known</em> about the actual process of translating the record, primarily because <em>those who knew the most about the translation, Joseph Smith and Oliver Cowdery, said the least about it</em>.  Moreover, Martin Harris, David Whitmer, and Emma Smith, who assisted Joseph, left no contemporary descriptions.  The sketchy accounts they recorded much later in life were often contradictory.</p>
<p>The Prophet was <em>reluctant to give the details about the translation</em>.  In a Church conference held 25-26 October 1831 in Orange, Ohio, Hyrum requested that a firsthand account of the coming forth of the Book of Mormon be given.  But the Prophet said, &#8220;It was not intended to tell the world all the particulars of the coming forth of the Book of Mormon.&#8221;  Joseph explained in an open letter to a newspaper editor in 1833 the heart of the matter, but he gave few particulars, stating that the Book of Mormon was &#8220;found through the ministration of an holy angel, and translated into our own language by the gift and power of God.&#8221;  (Church History in the Fullness of Times, p. 58, Church Education System, 1993.)</p></blockquote>
<p>This passage raises some interesting questions:  Why did Joseph and Oliver say so little about the method of translation of the Book of Mormon?  Why was Joseph Smith &#8220;reluctant to give the details about the translation&#8221;?  When Joseph Smith&#8217;s own brother Hyrum, who obviously believed in the Book of Mormon, asked Joseph to give a firsthand account of its coming forth to a Church conference, why did Joseph answer that &#8220;[i]t was not intended to tell the world all the particulars of the coming forth of the Book of Mormon&#8221;?  Why did Joseph stick to generalities about the Book of Mormon being translated &#8220;by the gift and power of God&#8221;?</p>
<p>Elder Holland&#8217;s fervent testimony that the Book of Mormon &#8220;came forth in the way Joseph said it came forth&#8221; takes on an interesting meaning when examined in the context of these statements.  It seems he too was testifying, in general terms, that the Book of Mormon came forth &#8220;by the gift and power of God,&#8221; which is a statement that adherents to the Inspired Fiction theory can fully agree with.</p>
<p>So what do you think?  Did Elder Holland intend to denounce the Inspired Fiction theory along with all other non-traditional theories about its orgins, or did he, consistent with his words in the first quote above, intentionally and carefully avoid it to provide room within the Church for those for whom the Inspired Fiction theory serves as a lifeline that keeps them tethered to the Church?</p>
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			<wfw:commentRss>http://mormonmatters.org/2009/10/07/did-elder-holland-denounce-or-intentionally-avoid-the-inspired-fiction-theory/feed/</wfw:commentRss>
		<slash:comments>257</slash:comments>
			<enclosure url="http://broadcast.lds.org/genconf/2009/10/50/GC_2009_10_503_HollandJR___eng_.wmv" length="39337712" type="video/x-ms-wmv" />
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		<item>
		<title>Feminist Conference Matching Game&#8211;Updated with Answers</title>
		<link>http://mormonmatters.org/2009/10/03/feminist-conference-matching-game/</link>
		<comments>http://mormonmatters.org/2009/10/03/feminist-conference-matching-game/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Oct 2009 22:15:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Bored in Vernal</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[apostles]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[feminism]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[General Authorities]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[General Conference]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonmatters.org/?p=7746</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Do you know your Apostles&#8217; wives? Bonus points if you can give first/maiden names in the comments. (Don&#8217;t cheat&#8211;only make a guess if you didn&#8217;t have to look it up!!) Katherine Jessop Christofferson[poll id="69"] Kathy Sue Williams Anderson[poll id="70"] Wendy L. Watson Nelson[poll id="71"] Mary Gaddie Cook[poll id="72"] Kristen Meredith McMain Oaks[poll id="73"] Mary Elene Crandall Hales[poll id="74"] Patricia Terry Holland[poll id="75"] Frances Beverly Johnson Monson[poll id="76"] Harriet Reich Uchtdorf[poll id="77"] Barbara Bowen Ballard[poll id="78"] Barbara Dayton Perry[poll id="79"] Kathleen Johnson Eyring[poll id="80"] Donna Smith Packer[poll id="81"] Susan Kae Robinson Bednar[poll id="82"] More bonus points if you know whose wife was mentioned during Saturday&#8217;s talks.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do you know your Apostles&#8217; wives?  Bonus points if you can give first/maiden names in the comments.  (Don&#8217;t cheat&#8211;only make a guess if you didn&#8217;t have to look it up!!)</p>
<p><a href="http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/Ssaefijg6aI/AAAAAAAAAaE/P_SrUETkJfY/s1600-h/13.jpg" onblur="try {parent.deselectBloggerImageGracefully();} catch(e) {}"><img id="BLOGGER_PHOTO_ID_5388168268884273570" style="margin: 0px auto 10px; text-align: center; cursor: pointer; width: 160px; height: 210px;" src="http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/Ssaefijg6aI/AAAAAAAAAaE/P_SrUETkJfY/s400/13.jpg" border="0" alt="" /></a><br />
Katherine Jessop Christofferson[poll id="69"]<span id="more-7746"></span></p>
<p><a href="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/Ssadnut7etI/AAAAAAAAAZ8/GQxTlhpPY90/s1600-h/12.jpg" onblur="try {parent.deselectBloggerImageGracefully();} catch(e) {}"><img id="BLOGGER_PHOTO_ID_5388167310076508882" style="margin: 50px auto 10px; text-align: center; cursor: pointer; width: 164px; height: 240px;" src="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/Ssadnut7etI/AAAAAAAAAZ8/GQxTlhpPY90/s400/12.jpg" border="0" alt="" /></a><br />
Kathy Sue Williams Anderson[poll id="70"]</p>
<p><a href="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/Ssacp3ZylvI/AAAAAAAAAZ0/AOy6s8pBf1k/s1600-h/11.jpg" onblur="try {parent.deselectBloggerImageGracefully();} catch(e) {}"><img id="BLOGGER_PHOTO_ID_5388166247256069874" style="margin: 50px auto 10px; text-align: center; cursor: pointer; width: 169px; height: 271px;" src="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/Ssacp3ZylvI/AAAAAAAAAZ0/AOy6s8pBf1k/s400/11.jpg" border="0" alt="" /></a><br />
Wendy L. Watson Nelson[poll id="71"]</p>
<p><a href="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsabUjVHxmI/AAAAAAAAAZs/KWY7n8ZBzz8/s1600-h/10.jpg" onblur="try {parent.deselectBloggerImageGracefully();} catch(e) {}"><img id="BLOGGER_PHOTO_ID_5388164781578896994" style="margin: 50px auto 10px; text-align: center; cursor: pointer; width: 160px; height: 344px;" src="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsabUjVHxmI/AAAAAAAAAZs/KWY7n8ZBzz8/s400/10.jpg" border="0" alt="" /></a><br />
Mary Gaddie Cook[poll id="72"]</p>
<p><a href="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaaCvaTF2I/AAAAAAAAAZk/LaAnBWvY2Mk/s1600-h/9.jpg" onblur="try {parent.deselectBloggerImageGracefully();} catch(e) {}"><img id="BLOGGER_PHOTO_ID_5388163376072562530" style="margin: 50px auto 10px; text-align: center; cursor: pointer; width: 160px; height: 192px;" src="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaaCvaTF2I/AAAAAAAAAZk/LaAnBWvY2Mk/s400/9.jpg" border="0" alt="" /></a><br />
Kristen Meredith McMain Oaks[poll id="73"]</p>
<p><a href="http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaYwQ8t5oI/AAAAAAAAAZc/QFARhoZFWjI/s1600-h/8.jpg" onblur="try {parent.deselectBloggerImageGracefully();} catch(e) {}"><img id="BLOGGER_PHOTO_ID_5388161959146153602" style="margin: 50px auto 10px; text-align: center; cursor: pointer; width: 160px; height: 250px;" src="http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaYwQ8t5oI/AAAAAAAAAZc/QFARhoZFWjI/s400/8.jpg" border="0" alt="" /></a><br />
Mary Elene Crandall Hales[poll id="74"]</p>
<p><a href="http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaX4rBwssI/AAAAAAAAAZU/RBHWQHE-Cxc/s1600-h/77.jpg" onblur="try {parent.deselectBloggerImageGracefully();} catch(e) {}"><img id="BLOGGER_PHOTO_ID_5388161004073956034" style="margin: 50px auto 10px; text-align: center; cursor: pointer; width: 161px; height: 300px;" src="http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaX4rBwssI/AAAAAAAAAZU/RBHWQHE-Cxc/s400/77.jpg" border="0" alt="" /></a><br />
Patricia Terry Holland[poll id="75"]</p>
<p><a href="http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaV4r1qLgI/AAAAAAAAAZM/-22hVz5Mo3Q/s1600-h/7.jpg" onblur="try {parent.deselectBloggerImageGracefully();} catch(e) {}"><img id="BLOGGER_PHOTO_ID_5388158805268377090" style="margin: 50px auto 10px; text-align: center; cursor: pointer; width: 170px; height: 210px;" src="http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaV4r1qLgI/AAAAAAAAAZM/-22hVz5Mo3Q/s400/7.jpg" border="0" alt="" /></a><br />
Frances Beverly Johnson Monson[poll id="76"]</p>
<p><a href="http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaVWFo8h8I/AAAAAAAAAZE/_32jCLSNzzo/s1600-h/6.jpg" onblur="try {parent.deselectBloggerImageGracefully();} catch(e) {}"><img id="BLOGGER_PHOTO_ID_5388158210898954178" style="margin: 50px auto 10px; text-align: center; cursor: pointer; width: 160px; height: 300px;" src="http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaVWFo8h8I/AAAAAAAAAZE/_32jCLSNzzo/s400/6.jpg" border="0" alt="" /></a><br />
Harriet Reich Uchtdorf[poll id="77"]</p>
<p><a href="http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaUJWSCT7I/AAAAAAAAAY8/ahs_2kIHZKc/s1600-h/55.jpg" onblur="try {parent.deselectBloggerImageGracefully();} catch(e) {}"><img id="BLOGGER_PHOTO_ID_5388156892516339634" style="margin: 50px auto 10px; text-align: center; cursor: pointer; width: 160px; height: 250px;" src="http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaUJWSCT7I/AAAAAAAAAY8/ahs_2kIHZKc/s400/55.jpg" border="0" alt="" /></a><br />
Barbara Bowen Ballard[poll id="78"]</p>
<p><a href="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaTLepsW8I/AAAAAAAAAY0/eoA_4uimbxQ/s1600-h/44.jpg" onblur="try {parent.deselectBloggerImageGracefully();} catch(e) {}"><img id="BLOGGER_PHOTO_ID_5388155829611158466" style="margin: 50px auto 10px; text-align: center; cursor: pointer; width: 160px; height: 290px;" src="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaTLepsW8I/AAAAAAAAAY0/eoA_4uimbxQ/s400/44.jpg" border="0" alt="" /></a><br />
Barbara Dayton Perry[poll id="79"]</p>
<p><a href="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaP4CUxerI/AAAAAAAAAYs/PRRsCSSEOX4/s1600-h/3.jpg" onblur="try {parent.deselectBloggerImageGracefully();} catch(e) {}"><img id="BLOGGER_PHOTO_ID_5388152197054823090" style="margin: 50px auto 10px; text-align: center; cursor: pointer; width: 175px; height: 200px;" src="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaP4CUxerI/AAAAAAAAAYs/PRRsCSSEOX4/s400/3.jpg" border="0" alt="" /></a><br />
Kathleen Johnson Eyring[poll id="80"]</p>
<p><a href="http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaPLchW0AI/AAAAAAAAAYk/XDhJRXE6rEE/s1600-h/1.jpg" onblur="try {parent.deselectBloggerImageGracefully();} catch(e) {}"><img id="BLOGGER_PHOTO_ID_5388151430992809986" style="margin: 50px auto 10px; text-align: center; cursor: pointer; width: 159px; height: 400px;" src="http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaPLchW0AI/AAAAAAAAAYk/XDhJRXE6rEE/s400/1.jpg" border="0" alt="" /></a><br />
Donna Smith Packer[poll id="81"]</p>
<p><a href="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaPHYjIfQI/AAAAAAAAAYc/pQ7qSa6F074/s1600-h/2.jpg" onblur="try {parent.deselectBloggerImageGracefully();} catch(e) {}"><img id="BLOGGER_PHOTO_ID_5388151361207041282" style="margin: 50px auto 10px; text-align: center; cursor: pointer; width: 159px; height: 350px;" src="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1OZixgeCpgE/SsaPHYjIfQI/AAAAAAAAAYc/pQ7qSa6F074/s400/2.jpg" border="0" alt="" /></a><br />
Susan Kae Robinson Bednar[poll id="82"]</p>
<p>More bonus points if you know whose wife was mentioned during Saturday&#8217;s talks.</p>
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